Bali Real Estate Market?

[mugwump]

A couple of my expat neighbors have expressed an opinion that the real estate market was fairly flat through out the Island, and wondered how many others would agree?
I guess this question was raised in my mind after recently visiting Ubud after being absent from that area for some time and seeing the vast throng of visitors plus numerous people I took for being expats. There has been a healthy expat population there in the past, but my impression was that it was greater now meaning foreign people residing there in larger numbers and being a healthier real estate market. Not looking to move, but was curious for other opinions.

 

[tel522]

the markets dropping like a stone in the water, nearby me their selling land with a free house ha ha !

 

[sakumabali]

Party is over mate, the land prices are too high. These people (you have seen) are either long term expats (that means even 5 years ago you still could get decent land prices) or (long term) tourists as there are PLENTY of cheap condotels everywhere! you pay less than 300.000 Rupiah in a fave hotel in Jalan Petitenget, in Nusa2 there are similar options for 600-700.000 Rupiah near the beach. And still there are every year many new premises.

But for a decent villa with 10 Are freehold you pay for the land alone 1 million dollar plus the house! On top you get free raids from banjar, police, government and perhaps villains who all don't believe that you live in there all yourself and all believe that you rent out illegally! Stress you get for 2 million dollars....
And your staff want a salary raise lol...seriously I totally understand why people choose to rent a house or a hotel room. In the old days we accepted the challenge above because it was CHEAP! why on earth should we continue doing this now when prices are ridiculously expensive? Having a million dollar villa and breaking your neck in an open gutter when leaving...when neighbors keep burning plastic trash next to your swimming pool....

 

[Markit]

Party is over mate, the land prices are too high. These people (you have seen) are either long term expats (that means even 5 years ago you still could get decent land prices) or (long term) tourists as there are PLENTY of cheap condotels everywhere! you pay less than 300.000 Rupiah in a fave hotel in Jalan Petitenget, in Nusa2 there are similar options for 600-700.000 Rupiah near the beach. And still there are every year many new premises.

But for a decent villa with 10 Are freehold you pay for the land alone 1 million dollar plus the house! On top you get free raids from banjar, police, government and perhaps villains who all don't believe that you live in there all yourself and all believe that you rent out illegally! Stress you get for 2 million dollars....
And your staff want a salary raise lol...seriously I totally understand why people choose to rent a house or a hotel room. In the old days we accepted the challenge above because it was CHEAP! why on earth should we continue doing this now when prices are ridiculously expensive? Having a million dollar villa and breaking your neck in an open gutter when leaving...when neighbors keep burning plastic trash next to your swimming pool....

Could not disagree more.

Prices here in the east have always been moderate compared to the horrible south (2nd paragraph says it all).

None of that is my experience of Bali, none!

 

[tel522]

Could not disagree more.

Prices here in the east have always been moderate compared to the horrible south (2nd paragraph says it all).

None of that is my experience of Bali, none!

I agree away from the south and ubud , land prices are more reasonable , but construction standards and materials leave a lot to be desired , hence major maintenance costs , in the local perumahans houses are terrible , new roof after 10 years ,15 years major renovation in some cases complete rebuild from the ground up , ridiculous .
what a liability ! property here is not an investment especially as prices are dropping substantially.

 

[mugwump]

Thanks Markit for your perspective on the east, and also believe the south is in a quagmire. Doesn't this indicate that things vary according to region?

 

[Markit]

As to building standards - that's up to the builder I think. You get what you deserve. If you are an absentee builder your chances of getting a good build are minimal, if you go everyday and take part you will be part of the process and able to control what happens. Building anywhere is really not rocket science - putting one stone on another with a bit of "muck" in between, in a reasonably straight line is not hard and can be done even by none DPS Balinese.

Your maintenance costs are continuous and ongoing particularly in the tropics regardless of how well the initial build was completed. If you don't paint it it rots.

I'm noticing a lot more construction outside of the capital - was in Lovina over weekend and lots of new builds (unfortunately also more derelicts).

Ubud is insane busy and seems that nobody is bother (or has time) to build there - noticed that prices there for a home stay have gone from 300k/night to 800k so why build?

 

[tel522]

I agree the tropics ruin houses especially if they are not built well , an example of good building standards , which I am sure you have seen on your travels is the dutch construction in the colonial period , in malang for example , still in good nic" , straight walls still original roof and woodwork .

 

[Markit]

I agree the tropics ruin houses especially if they are not built well , an example of good building standards , which I am sure you have seen on your travels is the dutch construction in the colonial period , in malang for example , still in good nic" , straight walls still original roof and woodwork .

A bit off topic but par for the course here - I saw a few of the original Dutch buildings in Malang on my travels but after going to the museum there found that most had been burnt down during the insurgency - rebellion - freedom fight (pick your cause).

 

[mugwump]

In Jembrana regency in West Bali specifically in my area most of the best land has been purchased by outsiders, but very little has been built on. In fact no beach access land built on in several years.

 

[Markit]

Years ago when I was looking around Tabanan to buy I saw that most of the best spots already had villas or homestays/hotels on them and the farther you get towards Negara the worse the beaches get - very shallow and rocky. I of course did not see them all before it starts to hail "my beach is different" and I'm sure there still are wonderful beaches. The rice terraces impressed me the most - huge fields of sweeping, curved emerald green.

 

[spicyayam]

was in Lovina over weekend and lots of new builds (unfortunately also more derelicts).

Do you mean the subdivisions with the tiny 1 are houses? Or something else?

There is still quite a bit of construction going on in the north. Prices are high I think mainly because they are trying to keep up with prices in the south.

I think the whole building/property industry took a dive from when that minister said the government would be clamping down on nominee agreements. It worried and still worries many people I believe.

The tax amnesty also made nominees realize that they will have tax obligations through these kinds of schemes which again has put some people off from wanting to become nominees.

There is at least one company in the north that seems to be doing ok as they keep building villas and they wouldn't keep building them if they weren't selling them.

 

[davita]

Re: post #10 &#11

Co-incidentally I met with a realtor pal in the pub last night. He had just returned from a large villa somewhere on the Tabanan/Jembrana coast to inspect a property for listing. He categorically told the seller he was wasting time asking the price he believed it should be worth...:greedy_dollars:, and suggested it would need such repairs he wasn't even willing to be the listing agent as it would spoil his reputation.

I bought him a drink...:drunk:

 

[sakumabali]

well I built 2 big villas on the Tabanan / Jembrana coast in 2006-2007 on the beach (almost 3000 m2) and I can tell it´d been quite a headache to maintain & sell the property...

location3 is not just a myth

that's what I meant, if some people here might think that the east or the north is a great place to invest - no offense but I don't agree
For a place to live it's too remote for me too - and land in the south (Bukit, Sanur, Kuta, Legian, Seminyak, Kerobokan, Denpasar, Renon, Jimbaran, Tuban and some km up north Sukawati, Ubud, Gianyar etc) IS getting too expensive (at least to invest)

To each his own

 

[DenpasarHouse]

Denpasar checking in.

Land values in our area doubled between 2011 an 2013 (300 million/are to 600 million/are) and luckily for us, we bought before they went up another 60-odd percent before the close of 2013. The developer tells us that the price now is still 1 billion/are inside our perumahan and 800 million/are outside it. However, no-one has bought anything since 2013. In typical Balinese fashion, no-one is lowering their prices . . . yet.

There's a lot of building and renovation going on though, just no-one buying land or established houses.

 

[tel522]

when the water runs out in south bali , I expect it will be like a ghost town down here , no water no life !

 

[davita]

when the water runs out in south bali , I expect it will be like a ghost town down here , no water no life !

There's already a lucrative market transporting water to expensive houses up the Bukit!

 

[tel522]

There's already a lucrative market transporting water to expensive houses up the Bukit!

indeed ! I had heard that , some people have been drilling 150 meters plus and all they find is salt water because of ingress in the bukit , I expect that will spread , In the past I have lived in a similar situation in africa , its boring and expensive ,I am planning to move out of the south in the next couple of years .

Pdam are struggling to provide water for the south even this year with the almost continual rain , the dry season was almost non existent .

 

[Markit]

I am planning to move out of the south in the next couple of years .

This appears to be the prime motivator for many (by no means all) of the new builds coming to east Bali. Most of the newbies are refugees from Ubud/south Bali and unfortunately seem to think that the close community of friends they have elsewhere will happily follow them to the pampas of Karangasem.

I know of several examples of people that have built here and still live in the hell of Ubud or Kuta because it's too quiet, haha.

Taint nuthin so queer as folk!

 

[tel522]

maybe your right mr markit , my motivations include water ,traffic and honestly after 9 years bali is becoming tiresome .