The Australian Disability Support Pension Overseas
- Status
These changes will only destroy families and breed contempt...
I agree with Banjo, except for the part where he stated thousands of recipients will be returning.
Jenny Macklins press release stated that only 175 people are regarded as residing overseas.
She stated the changes are being introduced to save the government a HUGE 3 million dollars.
I think a fairer option for those who ALREADY have families overseas would be to let them stay under the current regeme, and say limit some of thier fringe benefits.
I disagree with the bloke who said they arent spending thier pensions in Australia as they have to purchase 3-4 airfares a year, so that is in fact a fair slice of thier pension being spent in Australia. Not to mention what money they spend whilst here.
My concern is that the politicians and media are calling this a 'loophole' and painting the disabled overseas as people trying to scam the government. It makes them sound as if they are criminals. It's not a loophole or they would be warning these people when they first decide to travel.
I'm sure many of these people cant work due to thier disabilities and do have families to support.
Would'nt it be better to introduce this to new DSP travellers overseas from 2011 and warn people to the new laws so they dont go and get married and raise families?
Maybe let the ones with families stay there? after all they arent claiming medical or any of the other freebies available to them in Australia whilst abroad.
so who will be responsible for these families?
who knows: Maybe in susequent years the government will find themselves liable for the damage they will do to the lives of these families...
just my 2 bobs worth...
I agree with Banjo, except for the part where he stated thousands of recipients will be returning.
Jenny Macklins press release stated that only 175 people are regarded as residing overseas.
She stated the changes are being introduced to save the government a HUGE 3 million dollars.
I think a fairer option for those who ALREADY have families overseas would be to let them stay under the current regeme, and say limit some of thier fringe benefits.
I disagree with the bloke who said they arent spending thier pensions in Australia as they have to purchase 3-4 airfares a year, so that is in fact a fair slice of thier pension being spent in Australia. Not to mention what money they spend whilst here.
My concern is that the politicians and media are calling this a 'loophole' and painting the disabled overseas as people trying to scam the government. It makes them sound as if they are criminals. It's not a loophole or they would be warning these people when they first decide to travel.
I'm sure many of these people cant work due to thier disabilities and do have families to support.
Would'nt it be better to introduce this to new DSP travellers overseas from 2011 and warn people to the new laws so they dont go and get married and raise families?
Maybe let the ones with families stay there? after all they arent claiming medical or any of the other freebies available to them in Australia whilst abroad.
so who will be responsible for these families?
who knows: Maybe in susequent years the government will find themselves liable for the damage they will do to the lives of these families...
just my 2 bobs worth...
Jan McLucas and Jenny Macklins press release: 20th oct 2010
sorry - that was 154 people - not 175. just so no one gets confused here is a copy of that press release :
Introduction of legislation for new residency rules for Disability Support Pensioners
Jan McLucas,Jenny Macklin posted Wednesday, 20 October 2010
The Australian Government today introduced legislation to crack down on people on the Disability Support Pension (DSP) who live permanently overseas but return to Australia every 13 weeks in order to retain their pension.
The Families, Housing, Community Services and Indigenous Affairs and Other Legislation Amendment (Budget and Other Measures) Bill 2010 was introduced into Parliament today.
The legislation will close a loophole that has resulted in cases of DSP recipients living permanently overseas and flying back to Australia every 13 weeks to continue receiving the pension.
From January 2011, only DSP recipients permanently residing in Australia will be able to continue to receive the DSP except under limited and specific circumstances.
This change will bring DSP into line with other workforce age payments.
The Government is cracking down to ensure the system is fair and effective.
Analysis of data from the 2007-08 financial year shows that of DSP recipients who undertook more than three overseas trips, 154 spent less than eight weeks in Australia over the year. Of these 71 spent less than four weeks in Australia and eight spent less than a week here.
This change is expected to save taxpayers around $3 million a year when fully operational.
Currently, to apply for the DSP a person must be an Australian resident, however once granted they can continue to receive the DSP despite moving overseas permanently by returning to Australia every 13 weeks.
This legislation will ensure that DSP residents continue to be Australian residents to receive the pension.
Under the Social Security Act, residence is determined by examining a range of factors, including whether someone owns or rents property in Australia, whether they have assets in Australia, how long they plan to spend away from Australia and whether they have an Australian bank account.
The legislation will not affect DSP recipients who need to leave Australia temporarily, only those who choose to no longer permanently live in Australia.
The 13 week temporary absence rule will remain to allow DSP recipients to legitimately travel overseas for short periods.
The legislation will not affect any disability support pensioner who has portability under an international social security agreement, is grandfathered from changes introduced in 2001 or 2004, or is entitled to portability because they are severely disabled and terminally ill and overseas to be cared for by a family member.
The Government is committed to improving support to people with disability. As a result of pension increases announced last year and indexation, the DSP payment for singles on the maximum adult rate has been increased by around $115 per fortnight.
make your own assumptions, but I feel its pretty slack to be targeting such a minority group for $3 million when so much is being wasted elsewhere..
sorry - that was 154 people - not 175. just so no one gets confused here is a copy of that press release :
Introduction of legislation for new residency rules for Disability Support Pensioners
Jan McLucas,Jenny Macklin posted Wednesday, 20 October 2010
The Australian Government today introduced legislation to crack down on people on the Disability Support Pension (DSP) who live permanently overseas but return to Australia every 13 weeks in order to retain their pension.
The Families, Housing, Community Services and Indigenous Affairs and Other Legislation Amendment (Budget and Other Measures) Bill 2010 was introduced into Parliament today.
The legislation will close a loophole that has resulted in cases of DSP recipients living permanently overseas and flying back to Australia every 13 weeks to continue receiving the pension.
From January 2011, only DSP recipients permanently residing in Australia will be able to continue to receive the DSP except under limited and specific circumstances.
This change will bring DSP into line with other workforce age payments.
The Government is cracking down to ensure the system is fair and effective.
Analysis of data from the 2007-08 financial year shows that of DSP recipients who undertook more than three overseas trips, 154 spent less than eight weeks in Australia over the year. Of these 71 spent less than four weeks in Australia and eight spent less than a week here.
This change is expected to save taxpayers around $3 million a year when fully operational.
Currently, to apply for the DSP a person must be an Australian resident, however once granted they can continue to receive the DSP despite moving overseas permanently by returning to Australia every 13 weeks.
This legislation will ensure that DSP residents continue to be Australian residents to receive the pension.
Under the Social Security Act, residence is determined by examining a range of factors, including whether someone owns or rents property in Australia, whether they have assets in Australia, how long they plan to spend away from Australia and whether they have an Australian bank account.
The legislation will not affect DSP recipients who need to leave Australia temporarily, only those who choose to no longer permanently live in Australia.
The 13 week temporary absence rule will remain to allow DSP recipients to legitimately travel overseas for short periods.
The legislation will not affect any disability support pensioner who has portability under an international social security agreement, is grandfathered from changes introduced in 2001 or 2004, or is entitled to portability because they are severely disabled and terminally ill and overseas to be cared for by a family member.
The Government is committed to improving support to people with disability. As a result of pension increases announced last year and indexation, the DSP payment for singles on the maximum adult rate has been increased by around $115 per fortnight.
make your own assumptions, but I feel its pretty slack to be targeting such a minority group for $3 million when so much is being wasted elsewhere..
Fred2
Well-Known Member
I Wish
I"am a bit confused, Minority group not living in Australian but still living on a handout from the Australian goverment. sounds good to me were can I sign up??????
Mybe I should just go on unemployment while I live in Indonesia, I worked in Australia long enough???
I"am sure I could do something to get on the gravy train, Shiiiiiit me backs gone, I can"t feel my fingers on the key board. I will fly back to Australia & fill in the paper work tomorrow, OOOOps if my backs gone I can't fly, bugger it I will do it next month. will have to jump on the gravy train next month.
Have a lovely day in Paradise:icon_lol:
I"am a bit confused, Minority group not living in Australian but still living on a handout from the Australian goverment. sounds good to me were can I sign up??????
Mybe I should just go on unemployment while I live in Indonesia, I worked in Australia long enough???
I"am sure I could do something to get on the gravy train, Shiiiiiit me backs gone, I can"t feel my fingers on the key board. I will fly back to Australia & fill in the paper work tomorrow, OOOOps if my backs gone I can't fly, bugger it I will do it next month. will have to jump on the gravy train next month.
Have a lovely day in Paradise:icon_lol:
scout
Member
I would not call the DSP a handout. It is an extremely difficult pension to receive. The majority, and I repeat majority are genuinely ill, be it physical or mental. Sorry, but I get a bit angry with these type of comments, you make no mention of the OAP and the people on that can do what they like; so perhaps get on that gravy train of yours and head to the island of "care for your fellow australian"
:icon_evil:
Fred2
Well-Known Member
You think that They would get better care in Bali or Thailand then australia???????? As i said a gravy train, Now if they were living in Australia thats a different matter. OAP Sure I'll put my hand up if I get to that age. But then I will have to hide some assets Hmmmmm Your making me think, medicare will that work in Indo?????:icon_mrgreen: I wonder what the Australian goverment can give me that would make my life in paradise better???????
scout
Member
Missing the point
You, Fred, are totally missing the point. If you read the blog from the beginning, the fact is that people on pensions albiet DSP or OAP are living below the poverty line. They are choosing to live where the cost of living is comparable to the money they are receiving.
Walk a few 100 metres in their shoes, on the money they are to survive on, pay rent/mortgage, food, petrol, gas, electric, phone, school fees (if applic) etc etc etc etc etc. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE.
Ini adalah orang-orang seperti Anda yang membuat orang seperti saya begitu marah. Berhenti meletakkan orang lain yang membutuhkan bantuan, menjual aset Anda dan pergi dan tinggal di alaska
:icon_lol:
You, Fred, are totally missing the point. If you read the blog from the beginning, the fact is that people on pensions albiet DSP or OAP are living below the poverty line. They are choosing to live where the cost of living is comparable to the money they are receiving.
Walk a few 100 metres in their shoes, on the money they are to survive on, pay rent/mortgage, food, petrol, gas, electric, phone, school fees (if applic) etc etc etc etc etc. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE.
Ini adalah orang-orang seperti Anda yang membuat orang seperti saya begitu marah. Berhenti meletakkan orang lain yang membutuhkan bantuan, menjual aset Anda dan pergi dan tinggal di alaska
:icon_lol:
Fred2
Well-Known Member
Missing what point
As you say these people choose to live in anther country. The Australian goverment set rules for every person to recive the goverment pension. The pension my not be the best & I wish my father would get an extra 200.00 a week on his OAP:icon_biggrin:. Mind you he gets Free health, Free dental, Free rego, Free rail travel, Pension discount on most things, & rent sub ect ect ect. Most people do it hard to pay for there cars, house, schooling ect ect ect, there are 1,000's of pensioner living in australia on the same amount of money, do you think we should send them to asia because it better value for money???????. I should go to alaska because I don't have the same view point as you,:icon_sad:
Please,
As you say these people choose to live in anther country. The Australian goverment set rules for every person to recive the goverment pension. The pension my not be the best & I wish my father would get an extra 200.00 a week on his OAP:icon_biggrin:. Mind you he gets Free health, Free dental, Free rego, Free rail travel, Pension discount on most things, & rent sub ect ect ect. Most people do it hard to pay for there cars, house, schooling ect ect ect, there are 1,000's of pensioner living in australia on the same amount of money, do you think we should send them to asia because it better value for money???????. I should go to alaska because I don't have the same view point as you,:icon_sad:
Please,
cabaicabai
Member
Yep typical penny pinching dimwits in Canberra placating the rednecks. Noooo don't let those pensioners live it up over there in Bali. Never mind the fact that changing the rules and forcing them back to Australia is not only unfair it will actually end up costing the taxpayers more.
Oh well as long as the hansonites are happy.
Fred2 if your father is in such dire straits financially that he needs rent assistance at his time in life why don't you help him out for gods sake? :icon_rolleyes:
Oh well as long as the hansonites are happy.
Fred2 if your father is in such dire straits financially that he needs rent assistance at his time in life why don't you help him out for gods sake? :icon_rolleyes:
Last edited:
Fred2
Well-Known Member
Its part of your pension, wake up rent assistance is there for everyone that lives in AUSTRALIA. This will not force anyone back to Australia because they want to live in another country, hello is there anyone home!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:icon_lol:
cabaicabai
Member
One can only assume that your father is receiving rent assistance on an old age pension because he is destitute.
Give him a few bucks or better still take him in. At least Indonesians know how to take care of their of their extended family even though they are mostly poor.
The goverment shouldn't change the rules for those that have spent money relocating overseas especially since it will cost the tax payers more in the end anyway.
Better stay off the sauce mate.
Give him a few bucks or better still take him in. At least Indonesians know how to take care of their of their extended family even though they are mostly poor.
The goverment shouldn't change the rules for those that have spent money relocating overseas especially since it will cost the tax payers more in the end anyway.
Better stay off the sauce mate.
scout
Member
Rent assistance is NOT available for everyone that lives in Australia; it is means tested, the maximum amount being $95.00 (approx) per week, which is obviously not enough for those in the rental market.
As has been reiterated early; this is discrimination against those receiving the DSP. Anyone on an OAP can live where they like without this pathetic 13 week return back to good old Aussie.
Walk a mile in the shoes of someone who's life is dependent on this DSP before making rash judgements.
Oh I should mention Fred2 that Greenland is an interesting place also!!!!!!! :icon_lol:
Fred2
Well-Known Member
Still no geting it
One can only assume that your father is receiving rent assistance on an old age pension because he is destitute.
The rent assistance is part of the flexable system of the OAP, People know how to work the system to suit there own needs. My father is very happy with this system & knows how to adjust it to suit he's needs. As lots of people on the OAP have bank accounts in grand childrens names ect ect, there is so many ways to bend the system in your favor.
Now the DSP, as part of the condition of reciving the pension is reporting to centre link & they allow you to travel out side of Australia. If your disability will not allow you to work or retrain you, for more then 15hrs a week of work, If you meet the conditon & leave Australia permantly you do not have to comeback to Australia you just get paid. The idea of the pension is to help people until they can return to the work force, thats why it is only set for 2 years. This pension was never set out so people can relocat to a different country, Would you be happy if you can clam the dole & only report to centre link very 13 weeks, a lot of prole would relocat to Bali because they can get better dollar value????? Just kidding:icon_mrgreen:
Scout I always dreamed of living in paradise:icon_mrgreen: & I love it
One can only assume that your father is receiving rent assistance on an old age pension because he is destitute.
The rent assistance is part of the flexable system of the OAP, People know how to work the system to suit there own needs. My father is very happy with this system & knows how to adjust it to suit he's needs. As lots of people on the OAP have bank accounts in grand childrens names ect ect, there is so many ways to bend the system in your favor.
Now the DSP, as part of the condition of reciving the pension is reporting to centre link & they allow you to travel out side of Australia. If your disability will not allow you to work or retrain you, for more then 15hrs a week of work, If you meet the conditon & leave Australia permantly you do not have to comeback to Australia you just get paid. The idea of the pension is to help people until they can return to the work force, thats why it is only set for 2 years. This pension was never set out so people can relocat to a different country, Would you be happy if you can clam the dole & only report to centre link very 13 weeks, a lot of prole would relocat to Bali because they can get better dollar value????? Just kidding:icon_mrgreen:
Scout I always dreamed of living in paradise:icon_mrgreen: & I love it
scout
Member
Are you serious!!!
"The rent assistance is part of the flexable system of the OAP, People know how to work the system to suit there own needs. My father is very happy with this system & knows how to adjust it to suit he's needs. As lots of people on the OAP have bank accounts in grand childrens names ect ect, there is so many ways to bend the system in your favor."
Gee that great, so your father is stealing from the Government when it suits him, "adjusts it to suit his needs" CHARMING. The pusillanimously of your comments is beginning to grate
You obviously know NOTHING ABOUT THE DSP SYSTEM because what you have stated is ABSOLUTE NONSENSE.
Read the legislation pertaining to DSP and the criteria for receiving said pension
Then have an indepth conversation here with the FACTS
"The rent assistance is part of the flexable system of the OAP, People know how to work the system to suit there own needs. My father is very happy with this system & knows how to adjust it to suit he's needs. As lots of people on the OAP have bank accounts in grand childrens names ect ect, there is so many ways to bend the system in your favor."
Gee that great, so your father is stealing from the Government when it suits him, "adjusts it to suit his needs" CHARMING. The pusillanimously of your comments is beginning to grate
You obviously know NOTHING ABOUT THE DSP SYSTEM because what you have stated is ABSOLUTE NONSENSE.
Read the legislation pertaining to DSP and the criteria for receiving said pension
Then have an indepth conversation here with the FACTS
Fred2
Well-Known Member
Sorry scout but can you explain!!!!! I just went to the goverment web site & read the DSPoverseas site,
But still confused, Maybe you should read the conditions of eligibility for the DSP pension.
This is from the news paper.
In both countries, $700 a fortnight is considered a small fortune, much more than the earnings of many working full-time, who would consider themselves relatively well off.
Community Services Minister Jenny Macklin said the Federal Government would close the loophole, which allowed the 154 worst offenders to spend most of their time overseas, costing taxpayers $3 million a year.
Even though only Australian residents can lodge a claim for the disability support pension, and those on the DSP can only be absent from Australia for up to 13 weeks, there are cases of DSP recipients living permanently overseas and flying back to Australia every 13 weeks to continue receiving the pension, Ms Macklin said.
It is not known if those who claimed pensions while living overseas were working while overseas.
DSP Pension paid to Australia residents?????? they can travel out of Australia for upto 13 weeks?????
Please read the centre link act, there is no change to the OAP.
Please let me know what was wrong with my last post?????:icon_rolleyes:
But still confused, Maybe you should read the conditions of eligibility for the DSP pension.
This is from the news paper.
In both countries, $700 a fortnight is considered a small fortune, much more than the earnings of many working full-time, who would consider themselves relatively well off.
Community Services Minister Jenny Macklin said the Federal Government would close the loophole, which allowed the 154 worst offenders to spend most of their time overseas, costing taxpayers $3 million a year.
Even though only Australian residents can lodge a claim for the disability support pension, and those on the DSP can only be absent from Australia for up to 13 weeks, there are cases of DSP recipients living permanently overseas and flying back to Australia every 13 weeks to continue receiving the pension, Ms Macklin said.
It is not known if those who claimed pensions while living overseas were working while overseas.
DSP Pension paid to Australia residents?????? they can travel out of Australia for upto 13 weeks?????
Please read the centre link act, there is no change to the OAP.
Please let me know what was wrong with my last post?????:icon_rolleyes:
scout
Member
Agree to disagree!!
TRUCE!!
I dont have the time to debate this seriously; we are both going around in circles here.
You have read the Federal Government status on the DSP and the implications etc etc.
I know the legislation inside out, back the front, chewed it, lived it, fought it, cried over it.
I suggest that we remain on the opposite side of the debate. But, in my humble opinion, if you are not 100% sure of what you speak, eg: I just went to the Govt web site and read etc etc...... you are not privy to the magnitude of this system, please limit your comments to fact...
I have spent, many many years fighting this system, and believe me, it is a twisted road to travel.
All anyone here is asking for, is the right to choose...... ok
TRUCE!!
I dont have the time to debate this seriously; we are both going around in circles here.
You have read the Federal Government status on the DSP and the implications etc etc.
I know the legislation inside out, back the front, chewed it, lived it, fought it, cried over it.
I suggest that we remain on the opposite side of the debate. But, in my humble opinion, if you are not 100% sure of what you speak, eg: I just went to the Govt web site and read etc etc...... you are not privy to the magnitude of this system, please limit your comments to fact...
I have spent, many many years fighting this system, and believe me, it is a twisted road to travel.
All anyone here is asking for, is the right to choose...... ok
Fred2
Well-Known Member
No problem
I employ a few pensioners at work, some just need extra cash or what ever, centre link will ring me to check hours, so they don't miss out on anything. Five minutes later someone fom centre link will ring & ask the same.:icon_cry: Iam sure no one knows what going on in centre link & I really dont like dealing with them.:icon_evil: And Iam sorry you haven't changed my mind, anyway no harm done.
Still friends:icon_mrgreen:
I employ a few pensioners at work, some just need extra cash or what ever, centre link will ring me to check hours, so they don't miss out on anything. Five minutes later someone fom centre link will ring & ask the same.:icon_cry: Iam sure no one knows what going on in centre link & I really dont like dealing with them.:icon_evil: And Iam sorry you haven't changed my mind, anyway no harm done.
Still friends:icon_mrgreen:
Disability Pension
Pensioners of all types are often the easiest targets by governments trying to win votes or by those who swallow the media from the government trying to win votes. Someone who is paying ultra high taxes is someone earning large bucks.. guess it would be hard for them to realise that trying to live on the poverty line is tough. What a sad picture it is to kick someone poor and defensless while they are down.
Pensioners of all types are often the easiest targets by governments trying to win votes or by those who swallow the media from the government trying to win votes. Someone who is paying ultra high taxes is someone earning large bucks.. guess it would be hard for them to realise that trying to live on the poverty line is tough. What a sad picture it is to kick someone poor and defensless while they are down.
goldminer
Member
I dont think anybody is trying to kick people when they are down, it is simply a matter of living out of the country and still claiming their countries monies., that is what i dont like about it.
Maybe enough is enough...
I know I'm only a newcomer to the forum but this topic seems to be going around in circles. It seems neither side is going to convince the other by reasoned logic. Maybe it's run it's course and should just fade away before it becomes acrimonious? Let's all agree to disagree and leave it at that...
I know I'm only a newcomer to the forum but this topic seems to be going around in circles. It seems neither side is going to convince the other by reasoned logic. Maybe it's run it's course and should just fade away before it becomes acrimonious? Let's all agree to disagree and leave it at that...
- Status