17 years sounds short to me....I'm a complete novice at buying in Bali, but I wouldnt hand over an empty bintang bottle unless you have 25 years on top of that at a reasonable rate in contract ....not the price of gold index I saw one seller had used...what the!?
Hi Lea,
You sound like you've still got loads of questions waiting for answers. You don't seem to already have a definite carefully worked out financial plan and architect plan for the rebuild. You seem to be unsure of loads of legal and admin points about this hugely expensive adventure you're going into.
And yet you say "No Idea....I have until Tuesday at 11.30AM to change my mind...!!"
Surely you've got to have the whole plan completely organised and budgeted, with your own drawings of how the finished villa might look, all the legal angles completely detailed and clear in your mind etc etc etc ages before you get anywhere near a notaris or a deadline!
The only time I'd ever say something like "No Idea....I have until Tuesday at 11.30AM to change my mind...!!" is if I'm thinking of buying a sofa, not a lease on a plot of land in a foreign country.
Markit has already told you - "Buy in haste, repent at leisure".
For as long as you still have questions that need to be answered, then you aren't ready for the notaris.
Slow down! - no need to rush - never run after a bus, or a pretty girl (or maybe I should say, a handsome man suitable for a brave Shire Reeve) or a plot of land in Bali ..... there'll be another one along in no time at all!
Just a few of my thoughts. Good Luck!
You sound like you've still got loads of questions waiting for answers. You don't seem to already have a definite carefully worked out financial plan and architect plan for the rebuild. You seem to be unsure of loads of legal and admin points about this hugely expensive adventure you're going into.
And yet you say "No Idea....I have until Tuesday at 11.30AM to change my mind...!!"
Surely you've got to have the whole plan completely organised and budgeted, with your own drawings of how the finished villa might look, all the legal angles completely detailed and clear in your mind etc etc etc ages before you get anywhere near a notaris or a deadline!
The only time I'd ever say something like "No Idea....I have until Tuesday at 11.30AM to change my mind...!!" is if I'm thinking of buying a sofa, not a lease on a plot of land in a foreign country.
Markit has already told you - "Buy in haste, repent at leisure".
For as long as you still have questions that need to be answered, then you aren't ready for the notaris.
Slow down! - no need to rush - never run after a bus, or a pretty girl (or maybe I should say, a handsome man suitable for a brave Shire Reeve) or a plot of land in Bali ..... there'll be another one along in no time at all!
Just a few of my thoughts. Good Luck!
Hello Alex,
Thank you for all your comments..
The property has a one bed guest home plus a three bedroom/two bathroom villa..
Later in time, we will be knocking down the one bedroom guest house and rebuilding,
plus also with the villa...
Architects/drawings will be drawn and completed once we settle into the villa, no rush...
Thank you for all your comments..
The property has a one bed guest home plus a three bedroom/two bathroom villa..
Later in time, we will be knocking down the one bedroom guest house and rebuilding,
plus also with the villa...
Architects/drawings will be drawn and completed once we settle into the villa, no rush...
Lea if it was me I would be talking to all the other leaseholders that you can reach about their experiences with the owner and have you asked your seller why he's getting out after only 8 years (presuming he had a 25 year lease). Might want to check what he/they said with the neighbors too.
I don't see anything wrong with a 17 year lease if you can negotiate the extension and have that along with the price, included in the new contract. While you are talking to your neighbors ask them about their building experiences - I can't see you needing to go to the major (Kepala Desa) about renovation plans. Just check if your seller had an IMB - I know Shane from Ray White and he's a good guy and the company usually makes sure of all the paperwork before they accept a client but just check first.
What I would be very careful of is your rights of access - get a signed letter from the owner guaranteeing you the right to use the access roads - for the full term of the lease if not longer (forever?). You might want to make that letter a part of the contract of sale.
Tally ho and devil take the hindmost!
I don't see anything wrong with a 17 year lease if you can negotiate the extension and have that along with the price, included in the new contract. While you are talking to your neighbors ask them about their building experiences - I can't see you needing to go to the major (Kepala Desa) about renovation plans. Just check if your seller had an IMB - I know Shane from Ray White and he's a good guy and the company usually makes sure of all the paperwork before they accept a client but just check first.
What I would be very careful of is your rights of access - get a signed letter from the owner guaranteeing you the right to use the access roads - for the full term of the lease if not longer (forever?). You might want to make that letter a part of the contract of sale.
Tally ho and devil take the hindmost!
Markit is right Lea,
If the owner has multiple expats leasing his land, it wouldn't harm you to met some of them and ask their experience with the owner.
Also met the owner to confirm whether he are willing to extend the lease.
And I stand by my post on meeting with the klian, because when you are doing rebuilding, it means you will have a larger building than before, so your IMB has to be updated, which in the end needs the klian's signature.
I still remember a klian said to me so blatantly that he always needs "incentives" to remember his signature, so at least you would have a good relationship before you need him.:icon_e_smile:
If the owner has multiple expats leasing his land, it wouldn't harm you to met some of them and ask their experience with the owner.
Also met the owner to confirm whether he are willing to extend the lease.
And I stand by my post on meeting with the klian, because when you are doing rebuilding, it means you will have a larger building than before, so your IMB has to be updated, which in the end needs the klian's signature.
I still remember a klian said to me so blatantly that he always needs "incentives" to remember his signature, so at least you would have a good relationship before you need him.:icon_e_smile:
Sorry Lea,but the best advice after this question is PUT EVEYTHING ON HOLD.Obviously you have not yet any clue as to how things work in Bali.
The Banjar is the local neighbourhood organisation.They are very powerful and can levy any taxes on you they think fit.
I agree with former posters that 17 years is too short a lease for rebuilding.At least make sure the extension is 100% sure before signing anything.
Did you know you need the signatures from all your neighbours to obtain a new IMB?Do you see the minefield there,and the possibilities for extortion?Is Ray White working for the seller of the lease?Do you think they will give you all relevant information that might interfere with you signing?
If you would prefer to live in Sanur,why go on with this?Because it is affordable?Then ask yourself WHY it is affordable in this still highstrung market.
If you persist,go and talk to everyone in the neighbourhood who leases from the same man,and i mean Everyone.And go and speak to the head of the Banjar as well.
Methinks that if you just wait and keep looking,and start to have a local group of balinese who look out for a property in Sanur for you,that has not all these footangels,you might live a much happier life in Bali.
Good luck and much wisdom!
PS,i did all the things that i advocate here wrong myself when i bought my house,blinded as i was by the opportunity,but most things worked out well as i live in a fantastic village.But there is nothing you should be ashamed of,i can fairly safe say most of us have made mistakes like that.
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since this "deal" is being hendled by the immaculate Ray White...I am wondering why you have such basic questions like "adding my son to the lease?" or
"do I ask for extensions" ??? What does Teito do??, besides counting his commision ofcourse...
it sounds like a perumahan (subdivided land into parcels), is it?
"do I ask for extensions" ??? What does Teito do??, besides counting his commision ofcourse...
it sounds like a perumahan (subdivided land into parcels), is it?
Hi Lea...a quick word on extensions - 99% of them in Bali are not worth the paper they are written on.
When a contract states "extension available at market rate at the time of extension".......its useless. This leaves it open for the land owner to decide whether that land is to be valued at daily rental rate, yearly rental rate, land rate alone, land and villa rate combined etc.
Wording is critical - any loose ends and the land owners son is going to be doing everything in his power to get "his" land back (as in 17 years papa will have passed away and the son will be coming back for whats rightfully "his"). All the more for him if you've gone and built a new villa or done a top notch reno.
We had our last contract worded so that a contract extension was available, at a "SET" price. This is quite difficult though to determine what the value may be in 17 years time, so the contract is worded so that if we want to take the extension, it must be taken within 5 years from the date of original contract signing.
The "SET" price was the same price as original purchase price plus 20%.
So in 4 1/2 years we will make the purchase for the extension, and there can be no haggling over the price - as it is CLEARLY stated in the contract.
Agree with others - rushing is something sellers try to persuade you into so as to lessen your time to look at detail.
When a contract states "extension available at market rate at the time of extension".......its useless. This leaves it open for the land owner to decide whether that land is to be valued at daily rental rate, yearly rental rate, land rate alone, land and villa rate combined etc.
Wording is critical - any loose ends and the land owners son is going to be doing everything in his power to get "his" land back (as in 17 years papa will have passed away and the son will be coming back for whats rightfully "his"). All the more for him if you've gone and built a new villa or done a top notch reno.
We had our last contract worded so that a contract extension was available, at a "SET" price. This is quite difficult though to determine what the value may be in 17 years time, so the contract is worded so that if we want to take the extension, it must be taken within 5 years from the date of original contract signing.
The "SET" price was the same price as original purchase price plus 20%.
So in 4 1/2 years we will make the purchase for the extension, and there can be no haggling over the price - as it is CLEARLY stated in the contract.
Agree with others - rushing is something sellers try to persuade you into so as to lessen your time to look at detail.