New here!

[gtrken]

I just thought there would be more people like me who want to settle in Bali but don't have the 660k USD to own a fully foreign company. So we can collaborate , pool in and partner up. I also thought a good backpacker hostel or a good Airbnb would give good rental income along with the property appreciation..

Aren't there more people like that ?

There are a hell of a lot of people like that , especially in the southern part of the island. So many people like that who are building villas, homestays, kosts etal that very soon there will be more rooms available than tourists.
The back packer thing is a past thing. Now it's digital nomads who want free internet , nice surrounds , a/c , pool and expect to pay local Kost prices . Yes there is Air BnB but more and more people are becoming internet savvy and bypassing the expensive and looking online direct.

To further Markits analogy, a very close friend of mine built a 10 room Kost with pool on 7 are in Bukit Hijau in 2014 and cost including land was under 200K AUD.

My same , err, close friend is just now finishing off a 6 room Kost and 4 bed house with pool in about the same area on 5 are of land and the price is around the 380K AUD.

Do the maths on what you can rent a kost and a 4 bedroom house for and realise the numbers don't add up very well and as Britoo alludes to is that the locals have had similar properties for years and built WAY cheaper than my friend/you can do now and still make good money .

An additional note is my friend only built this to retire too later and just needs a better return than the banks will give, not to make a large profit.

Good luck with your endeavours but my advise to you is

Come for a Holiday
Keep the money in a good fixed term deposit
Go home knowing you will have no stress and the money is safe...

Cheers
Amateur financial advisor
Ken

 

[namit]

Airbnb rental? Here is some news. Authorities are keen to increase tax revenue so all current informal rentals will have to get permits/license's and start paying taxes.

https://thebalisun.com/officials-co...y-stay-at-specific-hotels-and-villas-in-bali/

Property appreciation? In the most popular areas, land prices are already sky high for basically rice field land. in Canggu selling price is typically USD 100,000 per 100m2 and sometimes as high as USD 200,000 per 100m2. Foreigners can only lease land (lets say for 25 years with optional renewal). Lease price is typically 25% of selling price, so USD 25,000-50,000 per 100m2 for 25 years.

The building itself will usually require a lot of upkeep otherwise fall into disrepair quickly. After 25 years only the land value left unless 100% attention to upkeep and regular renovations.

Thank you for taking the time to help me with some input. Lets do some calculations for the sake of constructive argument. Please help me with further inputs to make a profitability report helpful for me and other newbies

1) How much does it cost for optional renewal for further 25 years?
2) What is construction cost for luxury construction assuming 300 sqm Land with pool. Assuming 6 BHK
3) What would average monthly rental for such a property?

Need approximates or ranges only.

Thank you for your help

 

[namit]

T

keeping in mind, everything said above, you may want to follow up with some larger, established visa agents regards the Investor Visa (Index 313, 314).

This allows individuals to invest in a business rather than form one and has a much lower bar of 1 M. So you could invest in an existing business or club together with other to form a new business

As such, Visa / Legal services / Agents, I suspect are likely in touch with many individuals like yourself looking to gain access to Bali. in a similar manner, and will probably be able to act as a broker. They are of course incentivised via fees!

Do your due diligence before spending any cash but talking to them is free.


Cheers

Thank you for taking the time to help/advise me. Can you recommend me any visa agents who can help me further?

 

[namit]

I suspect you are more likely to find these people on the facebook community forums, canggu ubud etc .....

You might consider checking out some of their youtube videos too as the place is heaving with influenza types hustling. Searches like 'Bali lifestyle business' should hit the mark.

Sorry if I am teaching you how to suck eggs but check out good 'ol Phils website on property ownership if you haven't already. He's sceptical at 2017 price levels let alone 2023.

It's a crowded market and you are competing with the likes of Markit for example who bought at 15-years ago prices and locals who's family owned the land already.

If you are a digital marketing whizz that could of course be a game changer.

Likewise with the appreciation, if you are not careful, that will end up in the hands of the landowner if you lease as the terminal value of your lease is precisely zero.

Not saying you cant do it or that it cant be done. Picking the next hot area can result in eye watering profits but you'll need to be patient. Less than 10 years ago at Berawa beach I'd nod to the farmer herding his cows along the beach and then up the road by the Pura.

It is an entirely different kind of cattle market now.

Thank you for suggesting me about facebook groups and forums. Infact I posted on facebook groups and forums and till now I have already received 3 interests. Two spanish girls want to relocate to Bali and can invest 200K USD . They need a room for them self and the rest of the property can be put on rental daily/monthly . Likewise a German guy also contacted me about the same.

I realised there are many people like me who wants to relocate to Bali but cant invest the entire 660k USD . Also the idea of having a local partner and everything on their name and being on their mercy is dreaded by everyone.

Simple solution 3-4 people team up and start a fully foreign owned company. May keep a room each for themself and rent the rest of the property.

Also I found some websites like smemergers.com where 100s of Businesses of Bali and trying to raise funds for their hotels, clubs , bars, restaurant's etc.
I am no agent of the site. Just sharing what I found helpful.

 

[namit]

and you expect new arrivals to know this exactly how? Generally in the west "m" is the designation for "million" hence my posting.

I got confused too. Thank you for clarifying!

 

[Markit]

I have already received 3 interests. Two spanish girls want to relocate to Bali and can invest 200K USD . They need a room for them self and the rest of the property can be put on rental daily/monthly . Likewise a German guy also contacted me about the same. which of the 4 will own the proptery? which ever it is will need to have a company that now costs 1 billion to set up Or you must invest 5 billion to get a golden visa - not possible or a second home visa also 5 billion. all of you can't own the property - only one.

I realised there are many people like me who wants to relocate to Bali but cant invest the entire 660k USD . Also the idea of having a local partner and everything on their name and being on their mercy is dreaded by everyone. airbnb is on the way out as an option as the indo gov will crack down on those soon as most are illegal ditto with ownership through a local. also has many problems .

Simple solution 3-4 people team up and start a fully foreign owned company. May keep a room each for themself and rent the rest of the property. Illegal - indo is only allowing 5 billion for investment visas or the silly and badly named digital gonad visa for numpties to sit around in a/c cafes drinking overpriced soy lattes and tell each other tall stories of internet millions.

Also I found some websites like smemergers.com where 100s of Businesses of Bali and trying to raise funds for their hotels, clubs , bars, restaurant's etc.
I am no agent of the site. Just sharing what I found helpful.

 

[harryopal1]

What a complex and tricky aspiration. I have always thought that partnerships can be a problem. If the partnership involves mutal hands on activity there may come a time, if making a profit, where one thinks, "I am doing most of the work, damnit." And if losing money then the relationship can become quite acerbic. As for Facebook I am sure it is easy to find interested parties but of late there has been a big increase in Facebook being used for scamming. Once it comes to handing over money it might feel a bit like sailing off on a voyage of discover when it was known the earth was flat and a good chance of falling off the edge. Good luck.

 

[Shadrach]

What a complex and tricky aspiration. I have always thought that partnerships can be a problem. If the partnership involves mutal hands on activity there may come a time, if making a profit, where one thinks, "I am doing most of the work, damnit." And if losing money then the relationship can become quite acerbic. As for Facebook I am sure it is easy to find interested parties but of late there has been a big increase in Facebook being used for scamming. Once it comes to handing over money it might feel a bit like sailing off on a voyage of discover when it was known the earth was flat and a good chance of falling off the edge. Good luck.
View attachment 3851

I agree! I am in the process now of getting rid of a farm I had with friends. We were young and foolish when we all signed a contract without any bylaws about paying the taxes, what happens to ones share if they die, and so on. Now one of the owners died and his family can't be found, so we cannot get a clear title to sell the property for a good price. Someone is offering half value for the land and all the remaining owners just want out. I am sad and angry what was started with such good feelings, now stinks!
I would recommend to never sign a contract with partners! Especially ones that are friends. It only becomes a nightmare. If you want a contract, do it alone! Here you have to have a Indonesian partner anyway! That's scary enough.

 

[AuroraB]

"I have already received 3 interests. Two spanish girls want to relocate to Bali and can invest 200K USD . They need a room for them self and the rest of the property can be put on rental daily/monthly . Likewise a German guy also contacted me about the same."

What we need is an online portal that can warn all these wannabe Bali "investors" so when they search on tiktok or instagram site comes up on top. It is limited what this site can do to prevent disasters.

 

[AuroraB]

Thank you for taking the time to help me with some input. Lets do some calculations for the sake of constructive argument. Please help me with further inputs to make a profitability report helpful for me and other newbies

1) How much does it cost for optional renewal for further 25 years?
2) What is construction cost for luxury construction assuming 300 sqm Land with pool. Assuming 6 BHK
3) What would average monthly rental for such a property?

Need approximates or ranges only.

Thank you for your help

Reading your post you are lightyears away from being able to identify a sound business plan. As we said before you need a year on the ground here before you can make any sensible decisions. Even then people screw up major here.

You need to google and research. Plenty of price information there online. Fresh off the boat foreigners will obviously be shafted no matter what.

Have a look at this disaster here with delays and cost increases,

 

[Markit]

Reading your post you are lightyears away from being able to identify a sound business plan. As we said before you need a year on the ground here before you can make any sensible decisions. Even then people screw up major here.

You need to google and research. Plenty of price information there online. Fresh off the boat foreigners will obviously be shafted no matter what.

Have a look at this disaster here with delays and cost increases,

can't view the lasted vid but that's ok because I find his teeth strangely inhibiting...

 

[Balifrog]

Thank you for suggesting me about facebook groups and forums. Infact I posted on facebook groups and forums and till now I have already received 3 interests. Two spanish girls want to relocate to Bali and can invest 200K USD . They need a room for them self and the rest of the property can be put on rental daily/monthly . Likewise a German guy also contacted me about the same.

I realised there are many people like me who wants to relocate to Bali but cant invest the entire 660k USD . Also the idea of having a local partner and everything on their name and being on their mercy is dreaded by everyone.

Simple solution 3-4 people team up and start a fully foreign owned company. May keep a room each for themself and rent the rest of the property.

Also I found some websites like smemergers.com where 100s of Businesses of Bali and trying to raise funds for their hotels, clubs , bars, restaurant's etc.
I am no agent of the site. Just sharing what I found helpful.

There are so many red flags in this post, I don't know where to start
- Facebook
- Spontaneously finding 2 Spanish girls and 1 German with the same "aspirations" as you
- Partner with 3 or 4 people to invest => guaranteed disaster..

Come on holiday, look around and most importantly don't trust anybody !

30 years in SEA, I have seen so many disasters....

 

[Shadrach]

This all smells fishy to me. Anyone stupid enough to say they have a quarter of a million dollars and want to come here and buy something sounds like they don't have a clue! Is this real or AI generated?

 

[Shadrach]

After looking at all the different topics lately, I am feeling depressed. It's government stuff, or Israeli problems, or people wanting to spend millions on a pipe dream, the best thing lately I've seen is the topic of food. That made me feel good about life again. Thanks Balifrog! I feel depressed about life now, and think it's a topic that should be addressed sometimes! To candy coat everything is OK but it's not real! This is a subject I would like to talk about and hear from others how they deal with depresssion and sadness. As I get older, parts start to ache and bones don't heal as fast, I have enough financial security but being single living only with the local folks doesn't feed my soul, because of the lack of communication. Does anyone out there have this problem also? Let's talk about it. Please be nice!

 

[harryopal1]

After looking at all the different topics lately, I am feeling depressed. It's government stuff, or Israeli problems, or people wanting to spend millions on a pipe dream, the best thing lately I've seen is the topic of food. That made me feel good about life again. Thanks Balifrog! I feel depressed about life now, and think it's a topic that should be addressed sometimes! To candy coat everything is OK but it's not real! This is a subject I would like to talk about and hear from others how they deal with depresssion and sadness. As I get older, parts start to ache and bones don't heal as fast, I have enough financial security but being single living only with the local folks doesn't feed my soul, because of the lack of communication. Does anyone out there have this problem also? Let's talk about it. Please be nice!

It seems there comes a point in later life where so many people you have known have dropped off the planet. The sense of isolation is often felt even by people who have been dutiful if not excellent parents and then found their children can't be bothered maintaining contact. There is a general social trend to see elderly and handicapped people as not worth spending the time of day with them.

However you deal with it, it is worth remembering that in many respects depression can be a reasonable response to your circumstances. Important then not to beat yourself up by regarding yourself as having somehow failed. I once suggested to a son that walking, running or other vigorous exercise was proven to help. He angrily declared that all I had to offer were "bullshit platitudes." Gratuitous helpful suggestions are not usually well taken in life be it regarding depression or other issues. However, one of Australia's better known actors, Garry McDonald has suffered with life long depression and said that an early morning walk helped him. If you are not up to walking then working out to exercise or upbeat Google youtube videos may be useful. Perhaps these are just more "bullshit platitudes" but you did ask.

P.S. They say that laughter is the best medicine. If you haven't seen The Life of Brian then here is a really good dose of medicine.

 

[britoo]

This all smells fishy to me. Anyone stupid enough to say they have a quarter of a million dollars and want to come here and buy something sounds like they don't have a clue! Is this real or AI generated?

Concur, the way the post evolved left a whiff in the air for me and I wondered if the OP is marketing something.
Still waiting for the punchline.

 

[Markit]

After looking at all the different topics lately, I am feeling depressed. I think depression is just a function of bottling it all up - I'm accused (rightly?) of being a grumpy old fart and I accept that happily, and I do mean Happily! What's the point of running around with a smile on your lips and a song in your heart if all you want to really do is murder about half the people you meet. I'm also accused of being prejudiced BUT that only comes from recognizing the same assholes in different guises when they appear again and again and again. It's government stuff, or Israeli problems, or people wanting to spend millions on a pipe dream, the best thing lately I've seen is the topic of food. That made me feel good about life again. Thanks Balifrog! I feel depressed about life now, and think it's a topic that should be addressed sometimes! You should drink more beer. To candy coat everything is OK but it's not real! This is a subject I would like to talk about and hear from others how they deal with depresssion and sadness. If it's reality you're looking for just go to a local village and spend 9 or 10 hours solid in the market or village square watching the locals as they go about their day with less money than you and I would spend on a coffee and more work than I've done in 40 years BUT with a fecking smile on their faces that's too fast to be faked. As I get older, parts start to ache and bones don't heal as fast, I have enough financial security but being single living only with the local folks doesn't feed my soul, because of the lack of communication. Does anyone out there have this problem also? Let's talk about it. Please be nice!

You my friend are in desperate need of some local girl/boy/cow friend. They are relentless and generally horney as feck. When they should start to flag just bring out your wallet and show them it and that usually suffices to raise the mood immeasurably. And don't give me any of that "I only want true love" BS either I've been married to the same woman for the last 43 years so I know of where I speak. And they will help you get rid of any loose change you may have swilling about.
Are you still living in Padang Bai because if you are then right there is the major reason for your misery! I fecking hate the place and have done since the minute I saw it - it's hot, ugly and the people are assholes too, even the Balinese are miserable fecks there.

Once you've take my advice from above you'll find you have no time for world events and can't find a feck to give for most of them anyway.

Just cheer the feck up! (and move from Padang Bai)

 

[Balifrog]

After looking at all the different topics lately, I am feeling depressed. It's government stuff, or Israeli problems, or people wanting to spend millions on a pipe dream, the best thing lately I've seen is the topic of food. That made me feel good about life again. Thanks Balifrog! I feel depressed about life now, and think it's a topic that should be addressed sometimes! To candy coat everything is OK but it's not real! This is a subject I would like to talk about and hear from others how they deal with depresssion and sadness. As I get older, parts start to ache and bones don't heal as fast, I have enough financial security but being single living only with the local folks doesn't feed my soul, because of the lack of communication. Does anyone out there have this problem also? Let's talk about it. Please be nice!

Well, first of all I would NEVER live in a local environment, exactly for the reason you mention.
I love meeting with the team of old regulars at my favorite French place, speaking about food, geopolitics, history and so on..but no sport !
Secondly I would never live alone, I would have at least a few regulars or a girlfriend if not necessary a live in. Not easy to live with me as cooking and eating French food is mandatory.
But as @Markit said, with a few banknotes there is always a solution.
Old bones and so, yes it sucks to get.old. But I can still make some good moves on the dancefloor !
Going out once or twice a week, a few drinks, listen to the band, once or twice a my French place, Sunday lunch at the beachwith a few gin tonics..... I manage to survive !

Disclaimer : I am 70, live in Bali since 6 years and have a gf since 10 years. But we live together 6 weeks on, 6 weeks off.
We both need a bit of freedom.

 

[Shadrach]

Thanks to all of you for the great idea's and suggestions. I think the way I feel now will pass. My kids are coming in a couple of weeks so that will be nice to see them. Those were some funny suggestions, I will pass on having a live in. Better to just go to the bar and socialize there. The Life of Brian is a classic!

 

[Shadrach]

You my friend are in desperate need of some local girl/boy/cow friend. They are relentless and generally horney as feck. When they should start to flag just bring out your wallet and show them it and that usually suffices to raise the mood immeasurably. And don't give me any of that "I only want true love" BS either I've been married to the same woman for the last 43 years so I know of where I speak. And they will help you get rid of any loose change you may have swilling about.
Are you still living in Padang Bai because if you are then right there is the major reason for your misery! I fecking hate the place and have done since the minute I saw it - it's hot, ugly and the people are assholes too, even the Balinese are miserable fecks there.

Once you've take my advice from above you'll find you have no time for world events and can't find a feck to give for most of them anyway.

Just cheer the feck up! (and move from Padang Bai)

Well my friend, You are absolutely right! I have the the luxury to grovel in my self pity. I'll skip the sitting at the market, but I get what you mean. As I said, my kids are coming and that will give me a spark in life. There is a young friend in the States that just had a serious accident and smashed his face. He is in the hospital and has to have reconstruction surgery on his face and work on saving his eyesight! It makes me realize I am lucky to have the health I have. Luckily he has no brain damage. Thanks for your input. Sometimes we need it!