Using endangered species for tourist entertainment.

[rien.gluvers]

I just read on the Internet about the Melka hotel in Lovina having some endangered species and dolphins in their zoo.
It is not appropriate for a modern enterprise to keep such animals for tourist entertainment and I hope that officials will look into it. Also I hope that environmental-aware people will stay away from such places as long us the abuse is continuing

 

[Roy]

Rien, Eri and I have stayed at the Melka in Lovina twice in the last two years, and yes, you are totally correct. They have a number of endangered species there including moon bears and orangutans. That being said, it did seem as we wandered about their zoo that the animals were well kept and it was interesting how the zoo area is integrated into the hotel grounds.

I “hear” what you are saying, loud and clear, but I personally wonder more about the future fate of these animals if they were turned over to what you call “the officials.”

Also, from what I understand, the owner of the Melka is licensed to keep these animals.

 

[rien.gluvers]

Dear Roy,
There is no way they are licensed for holding orang-utans and the only way they could obtain such animals is an illegal way. They have been visited by the Sumatran Orang Utan Society already. This organisation will try to get this apes in one of their sanctuaries. But like everything in Indonesia the red tape is not speeding things up. For now I think the only way to stop the wildlife being illegally wild caught from their habitats is to boycott all the businesses that think they can get away with it.

 

[Ipanema]

When I was in Bali last week I heard from another Aussie that there was a hotel in Lovina that you could swim with the dolphins. I mean jump in a pool and swim with them, not just feed them.

I have done this in Australia through SeaWorld BUT every precaution is put in place as they are still wild animals. I am not sure if this will make much sense to some people but the dolphin that played Flipper in the latest "Flipper" series was from Seaworld and he was in the pool with us and he kept sticking his nose into what we were doing with another dolphin. They took us out of the pool as they will not interfer in the dolphins 'society'. They cannot be seen as taking sides and withdraw in times like that.

Very interesting believe me. It was "Trainer for a Day". We got to do tricks and all sorts of things with them but very little swimming time.

I am rambling sorry. I was concerned when told that peope could just jump in a pool and swim with dolphins, disease etc for the dolphins.

I am wondering if this is the same hotel.

 

[Roy]

Rien, where on the internet did you first read about the "zoo" at the Melka? I for one would be interested in reading more about what was written.

I agree with you that the orangutans would be far better off in a sanctuary than in the cages they are presently being held.

My initial concern after reading your first post is that these animals would simply be taken by “officials” and released into the wild. That would be a certain death sentence for them.

As an aside, I recently met a well known English orthinologist, (sp?) and close friend of Victor Mason here in Bali. They are both working very hard with the highly endangered Bali Starling project. Unfortunately, they have had no success with the survival of Bali Starlings once released from the “secret” sanctuary into the wild.

In the meantime, while all the "red tape" is sorted out, boycotting the Melka could negatively impact the animals being kept there, assuming that some portion of the hotel’s income is used to provide food and care for the animals.

That a whole lot of work to preserve and conserve all the natural resources of Indonesia, including its wild life, is desperately needed is inarguable. In recent years, Indonesian TV has carried a number of public service announcements geared to educating the local population. Changing the attitudes of the local people regarding these issues is a long and difficult process. In addition, serious outside funding and expertise in managing the endangered wildlife is desperately needed. Hopefully this needed assistance will come before it’s too late for the endangered species.

 

[iainsomers]

The always and forever discussion between the theoretical and practical right way (and all ways in between). Rien is right in theory but, I agree with Roy that just boycotting maybe isnt the right solution. But doing nothing is in this case maybe also not the best. In my opinion better solutions i.e.:

1. Find out wich travel-companies are the main supplier of tourist for that hotel and talk with them about closing the zoo.
2. Structually enhance the way the animals are kept and minimalise physical contact with humans within the hotel area.

But I would like to remark that I think both Rien and I are not in the right position to give a balanced opinion and certainly not in the position to suggest possible solutions. If Balinese animal rights/conservation groups are aware of this, than that should do imho.

 

[rien.gluvers]

Re: RE: Using endangered species for tourist entertainment.

Rien, where on the internet did you first read about the "zoo" at the Melka? I for one would be interested in reading more about what was written.

I can give the url, but is is form a dutch msn-group an in de dutch language. http://groups.msn.com/VriendenvanBali

Regarding the financial needs to keep these animals I can see yor point. Only I don't agree. If we, the visitors, give them a steady income they certainly in the future will expand their "zoo".

 

[Roy]

Regarding the financial needs to keep these animals I can see yor point. Only I don't agree. If we, the visitors, give them a steady income they certainly in the future will expand their "zoo".

So cut off their income by way of a boycott, and let all the existing animals die or be sold off to God know who in order to prevent anymore from being put there?

In reality, I can't see how they could fit in anymore. The place is already full up, and even the dining area is full of large salt water fish tanks.

It's a tough nut Rien, but I think history has shown in the past that boycotts don't work effectively and in fact can backfire by calling more attention to the place...i.e. lots of free publicity/advertising.

 

[Norm]

Re: RE: Using endangered species for tourist entertainment.

That a whole lot of work to preserve and conserve all the natural resources of Indonesia, including its wild life, is desperately needed is inarguable. .......Changing the attitudes of the local people regarding these issues is a long and difficult process. In addition, serious outside funding and expertise in managing the endangered wildlife is desperately needed. Hopefully this needed assistance will come before it’s too late for the endangered species.

There is a good deal of work being done within Indonesia for example have a look at this website

http://www.fnpf.org/about/contact.htm

They are taking a wholistic approach of Community Development/re-afforestation/animal protection and rehabilitation in their Borneo project - very impressive, but, as Roy quite rightly says "serious outside funding and expertise ...is desperately needed" - and that applies strongly to this organisation.

From what I read the fundraising is the major issue, particularly so in a country like Indonesia, that is somewhat less affluent than others and which has a mountain of social and economic problems to overcome. I am hoping that I can assist FNPF in some way; perhaps after reading the website others might like to do the same.

BTW Roy I think "ornithologist" might be the word you were looking for :?

 

[Roy]

BTW Roy I think "ornithologist" might be the word you were looking for

Yup, that's the one...birdmen. Thanks Norm!

 

[Norm]

I share Rein's concern regarding the treatment of animals. For example did anyone see the news item on the Chinese"Animal Olympics"? This included two bears "fighting" in a "boxing match" which I found quite revolting.

As far as the morality of keeping animals in captivity is concerned I look at it on a number of levels;

The big picture for many liberationalists would be to suggest that in an ideal world no animal should be in captivity. Sadly we do not have an ideal world. Humans breed animals for the benefit of humans; whether for food, or for other products; for servitude; for entertainment, and as pets. How much of that are humans prepared to give up to liberate animals? To answer my own question I think there are signs of humans begining to mature and I think there will be a very gradual decline in animal use, at least in proportion to the human population. On this level a complete change of human attitude and behaviour is required.

The medium picture is about any particular animal or any particular species. All great apes are endangered because of the actions of humans, who of course are their closest relations. The loss of habitat such as deforestation is the major cause. Orang-utans are rescued by NGOs such as BOS or FNPF they recuperate and are eventually rehabilitated in a conserved area. I see the rehab process as an opportunity for interaction with humans, through eco-tourism. It way well help raise money for the work of these NGOs and help spread the word about the need for action. I have to say that many world authorites, such as Jane Goodall, do not see it that way and I respect their viewpoint. They prefer to safeguard the individual from human contact/reliance since it makes rehab so much more difficult. Some of these animals will never rehab back to nature because they have not learned basic survival skills. So what is their future, other than some form of human support, which could be interpreted as captivity?

This is the level that demands the most urgent human intervention because if we don't act now some of our closest relatives will be gone forever.

Finally the smaller picture involves individual creatures. We have to accept where things are and therefore where we can go from here. We have to ask "what is best for this particular animal right here?" What would happen to your budgie if freed from its cage; or to the moon bears in Lovina; or the dolphins at Seaworld. If released the vast majority of such animals would die quite quickly. Two suggestions - make sure they are well cared for where they are and make sure we aim to reduce the incidence of animal captivity in future.

 

[Mbok_Mary]

Hi Norm,

I am delighted to read someone else's promotion of the great work FNPF does in Kalimantan and Bali! I wrote a bit about my experience of living on their Nusa Penida Bird Sanctuary this year for 4 months in an old (short-lived) string on this forum: "eco tourism in Bali." Unfortunately, I don't think the topic captured folks' interest or attention at the time, because my post was the last one contributed... but since you brought them up again...

FNPF has a fantastic, community-centered, wholistic approach to their work. I can personally vouch for this, as I lived with them for 4 months and witnessed their daily activities. In fact, their willingness to collaborate and open their resources up to other community-benefitting projects is precisley what enabled me to live on their sanctuary: I met the Director, Pak Bayu, when I was teaching for a non-profit in Ubud. He invited me to see the FNPF project on Nusa Penida, and after my visit, it was only a short time before I returned to teach at the 1 local high school on the island - this was only possible due to the collaboration between FNPF, the local villages, and the local school Headmasters who all worked together to make my visit/work possible for the students there. As a side note, for those interested in the Bali Starling, FNPF has a very successful program with these rare birds, and so far so good on the survival rate of the ones released this past July.

YES funding is a big issue for FNPF and other organizations like it, especially because they are a completely Indonesian-run non-profit with no tax ID numbers for donors' tax exemptions in other, Western (read: where significant donations can be raised) countries. This is an issue I am trying to work on! I returned to the U.S. this June with the intention of trying to raise some US money for FNPF - I am still in the beginning stages of this effort, it may involve establishing a US FNPF non-profit, I'm not certain yet (but open to ideas!). They are interested in doing more work with local student groups and education, not solely working with plants and animals...this is where I (hopefully) come in. I want to continue to assist them in this optimistic effort, and would love to return to Nusa Penida to teach again. (especially since it is the Director's opinion that my work in the schools helped to increase community support and awareness for FNPF's conservation work).

And now I am rambling, but as you can tell, I am passionate about the work FNPF does and their wonderful staff. And, if you or anybody else has any ideas how I can utilize my time in the US to help fund-raise for FNPF - I would love to hear it!

or, if folks reading this string would like to hear more about eco-work being done on Nusa Penida, generally, I can say more about that, too. It is not often I meet people who know much about Nusa Penida other than it has good snorkelling, good scuba diving, and near Nusa Lembongan! People rarely visit or spend the night...

 

[Norm]

Good to hear such a positive story from you, Mary.

Just as a curiosity I wonder how many members of this forum have heard of FNPF? However slight your knowledge of the organisation might be would you do a brief post letting us know if you have heard of them; and, if so, what you know of them.

 

[Ipanema]

No, have not heard of FNPF but I am not an expat.

The information was appreciated and interesting, keep us informed, you never know how individual people can help, or pass on information to make more people aware.

I am an animal lover and when I do come to live in Bali I will be actively helping these group. Especially cllose to me is the wild dogs of bali.

 

[Mbok_Mary]

I do know that FNPF had a booth at the Ubud Writers and Readers Festival this past weekend, so am hoping this helped to raise some awareness of their existence and their work. I wonder if reasons contributing to the fact they are not as well known as some other Ubud-based non-profit organizations may be:

1. They were not started by Western expats, nor are there any Western expats on staff at present time in Bali (there is a Malaysian woman on staff)
2. They started their organization's work in Kalimantan several years ago, and established their sanctuary in Bali only about 2 years ago (2004 I think)

In my opinion (and I admit I am not an expat, as I am back living in the US now) the NGOs in Bali who were started/run/connected to Western expats are getting the most press and, perhaps as a result, the most money from donations and volunteers. Is this true? What is your opinion? I am thinking, for example, of Bali Hati, Threads of Life, VIBE/IDEP, Helen Flavel, John Fawcett, East Bali Poverty Project...all of which do great work. All of which have Western expat founders. Can those of you who live in Bali name many Balinese-founded NGOs, like FNPF? I would be most interested in hearing about them too.

 

[jogry blok]

Rien, I am totally in agreement with you.

 

[orang gila]

It's one of these difficult life decisions.

While we would prefer animals to be in their natural habitat, we have a couple of Sumatran Macaques; the male came from a Balinese friend who could no longer look after him, and the female came from the conservation dept, as they said they couldn't afford to feed her. (even though they had her caged less than 100 metres from the Candi Kuning fruit market)

What can we do with them, apart from make sure thay are cared for? We can't set them free, as they are not native to Bali.
We can't rehabilitate them, as it's out of the question funds wise, and as I said, we actually accepted one from the authorities.

The story I heard about the Dolphins at Melka, was that at least one was "rescued" from a private zoo, and was in very bad condition. While it's not in the wild, it's in better condition than before.

That's how we feel about Barbie & Spanky, our Macaques, and other animals that we have accepted, we give them more than they had before they came to us. The first monkey we saved was a baby Languer(?)

We found her whilst buying bird seed at a pet shop, and as she looked so distressed, we made the store owner an offer and tried to save her life. After contact with Perth & Santiago zoos, we did our best, but both zoos had warned us to not become too attached as survival rate of motherless babies was about zero percent, even in zoos. This baby died at about 8 months, and it was heartbreaking.

As people now knew we were animal lovers, we were given a couple more Languers that were either sick or unwanted, same results, and more heartbreak.

We'd say, don't persecute those who are doing their best to look after sick or unwanted animals, go after the root cause and that's the poachers who kill the mothers to take the babies, but in discussions with a friend from the conservation dep't, this is a big and more or less, impossible job.

 

[rien.gluvers]

Re: RE: Using endangered species for tourist entertainment.

We'd say, don't persecute those who are doing their best to look after sick or unwanted animals, go after the root cause and that's the poachers who kill the mothers to take the babies, but in discussions with a friend from the conservation dep't, this is a big and more or less, impossible job.

I will never persecute people who are just trying to do their best. But in this case it is commercial exploitation of these animals. Even if one of the animals now is better of then before it will not make things ok. The poaching is a matter of economics. Ass long as people even with the best intentions will buy these animals, the poachers will keep on doing there evil “work”. The only way to stop this is by ending the demand. This can be achieved by economically hurting all the people and businesses who are involved in anyway in the process from catching, selling/buying, transportation till exploitation.

 

[iainsomers]

As I understand now a little (the dolfin was"recued") its maybe better to let somebody with knowledge about dolfins some education to the owners. This will not create an ideal situation, but there are bigger problems in the animal-world (i.e. mistreatment of consumption-animals, ruining habitats escpec in rain forests).

 

[Roy]

Screw it! I’m going to “come clean.” In my previous posts on this subject raised by Rien, I’ve done my best to be diplomatic...even politically correct, but I have disguised my true feelings, and that isn’t me...nope, not me at all.

I say, “bloody hell with the animals.” This is Indonesia, with poverty and other social issues which demand to be addressed before the fauna of Indonesia.

I have a very, very hard time reconciling in my mind that funds are directed to preserve animals, endangered, or not, while thousands of ORANG (human beings)...living and breathing homo sapiens, starve in various parts of Indonesia. Yes, I love animals. BUT, I love my fellow man a whole lot more!

Where the hell are our priorities? Would anyone here feed a starving orangutan over a human if faced with only enough food for one or the other?

The problem, as I see it, with Rien’s initial post, and his follow up posts, is that he views Indonesia from Belanda glasses. He has imposed upon Indonesia a sort of responsibility which clearly Europe can afford to engage, but Indonesia cannot. Jorgy has done the same with simple agreement to Rien, but without any expansion. Neither, by the way, have ever been to the Melka in Lovina.

YES...I did post the Bali dog “benefit auction” string. Why, given these comments? To be honest, because Helen’s good work with impoverished and undereducated kids up north may benefit in some way. Given the present day challenges of addressing the basic needs of too many impoverished Balinese kids, I frankly couldn’t give a shit for any dog...Balinese, or otherwise.

While some orang Belanda may often offer insights to how Indonesia should be run...often in too many respects, they often ignore the reality of Indonesia. Neither the Islamic, or Hindu elements of Indonesia will ever put animals as equal in their concern. Nor should the West try to force feed these ideas upon them.

That’s the culture here, and I personally pray it will never change. Leave the animals to Darwin. Hundreds of thousands of species eventually fell to their failure to evolve, and climatic changes. That is nothing more than the cycle of life.