Electricity costs

[Roy]

Selamat "Crafty" good job. The “boss” is home after a long night of gamelan practice, and informs me that we pay about 2 to 2.5 million a month for all our utilities...two homes, and a gallery. That includes city water at the gallery and one home, (the other has a well), electric, and two telephones, (with endless hours on the internet).

That sures seems like a bargain to me, as when I left New York City almost eight years ago, I couldn't park my car for a month in a garage there for less than $300 a month, let alone pay for any gas to drive it out of the garage.

This is all “relative” and by that I mean that when an expat lives on Bali, and spends the same for utilities as the Balinese, I personally find that reasonable and fair.

 

[CraftyCol]

Hi Roy, thanks for the feedback. Tomorrow, I'm going to go back over all the posts on this thread to see how the various usages might tally with the charge rates I've been given.

Unless I can get more power rating on a 'Regular' tarif, it looks like I will be on the Bisnis rating. And, on that basis, there is no incentive for me (other than installation costs) to take a lower rating than the 33kva that my electrician recommends I need. (same usage costs for a 16.5kva as a 33kva)

For sure, I am unlikely to use much more than 6100wh in a month, unless I have a full house for the whole of it, but potentially being in the position at the peak time (early evening) to be running 5 ACs, 4 pumps, kitchen equipment, TVs and lighting I don't want to trip the system with an underpowered supply.

Currently residing in the Middle East with its very low energy costs I suppose that I have been lucky so far but this makes the jump to Bali prices quite shocking. Meanwhile, I'm winging a few e-mail messages to friends around the world to get some prices from the real world!

Cheers,
C

 

[CraftyCol]

Well, it has taken some time but I've now found out that the electricity costs I posted in late April are correct but they only apply to new applicants.
So, beware anyone who is about to apply for a new supply - the costs are rediculous!
Meanwhile, I'm beefing up the dynamo on my exercise bike!!

 

[mungo]

Hope this is not too long, but the data was taken from an Australian energy consumption chart and hopefully it may guide you as to what power your appliances are consuming:

On average

Cooling
Room air-conditioner (0.75hp) 800 Watts
Room air-conditioner (1.5hp) 1400
Room air-conditioner (2.5hp) 2500
Ceiling Fan - mid speed range 50
Ceiling Fan - high 80
Pedestal Fan 40

Hot Water Heating
Electric Storage3 - 50litre, 3.6kW
switched on all day 520
switched on for 1 hour per day 150

Refrigerator & Freezer
Refrigerator (1 door manual)T 80
Refrigerator (2 door auto defrost)T 150
Refrigerator (2 door manual defrost)T 200
Chest FreezerT 50
Refrigerator ("Beer frig")T - old 220

Cooking
Electric Stove (small element) - (1.25kWs) 700 Watts
Electric Stove (large element) - ( 1.8kWs) 1200
Electric Stove (grill) - (1.8kW) 1800
Electric Stove (oven)T 1100
Microwave - high 1600
Electric Kettle 2400
Toaster 1500
Food processor 450
Consumption per load kWh
Diswasher - Normal Cycle 1.35
Diswasher - "Econo" Cycle 0.60
Washing Machine - top loading 0.33

Bad Habits Typical

Electric Hot Water Service - on continuously 520 Watts
TV, VCR, Stereo, DVD & Cable on standby 34
Computer & printer left on 150
"Beer Fridge" 220
Ceiling Fan - mid speed on continuously 50
Ceiling Fan - high speed on continuously 80
Lighting Watts
Compact Fluorescent - CFL 10
18 watt fluorescent fitting 24
36 watt fluorescent fitting 43
40 watt incandescent gloge 40
60 watt incandescent gloge 60
75 watt incandescent gloge 75
100 watt paraflood 100
50 watt dichroic lamp 50
35 watt dichroic lamp 35

Computing
Computer - operating 110 Watts
Computer - monitor off 60
Printer 40

Entertainment
Television - 70cm colour 110 Watts
Television - 50cm colour 60
Stereo 50
VCR 20
DVD Player 20
Cable TV control box 15


Other
Clothes Drier 2500 Watts
Swimming Pool Pump 1100
Mobile phone charger - charging 5
Fan Heater 2400W 2400

Stand-by

Computer 4 Watts
Computer speakers 3
Monitor 3
Printer 5
Scanner 3
Split system air conditioner 15
Microwave 3
Television - colour 4
Stereo 5
VCR 5
DVD player 6
Cable TV controller 14
Answering machine 2
Mobile phone charger 1

 

[Roy]

Thanks Mungo. I’m really enjoying your revival of old strings.

 

[mungo]

I hope this doesn't seem like a dumb question, but my bill in Australia for 60 - 62 days averages 881 units in summer/ autumn(a unit being a Kw) upto 1270 units winter/spring(1,270 Kw). My bill ranges between AUD$150 - $220 per 2 month period. I have 2 child, wife, a 4 bed house with 4 tv's R/C A/c fridge, freezer, elec stove, two pc's, 3 stereo, 4 elec clocks, mw oven, wash m, dryer, and a lot of lights(I only just realised how much junk I have).

Now the wattage rates that you show:

• are they your usage quota per month/period?

• or are they the potential usage per household at any given time? (like when everything is on at full blast)

• or are you paying for a limited consumption level whether you use it or not?

If someone could explain as I find with just about everything else on the great island being so cheap, your power bills seem dearer than Australia.

 

[Roy]

Mungo, all I can say about electricity charges here is that even the Balinese aren’t sure how their bills are determined. In our two houses and gallery, we see the “meter reader” about three times a year. Without doubt, our monthly bill is most often estimated.

In Ubud there is very little need for air conditioning, so that watt eating monster is generally not in use. Actually, our air con has only been turned on twice in many years...both times when my mom was visiting.

I agree that electricity is unquestionably the highest utility on Bali, but given what you describe as your charges in OZ, I don’t think it’s much worse here. Expats down south, where air conditioning is a necessity would likely say differently.

In the end, as one accounts for all their costs of living, Bali is still a great deal.

 

[mungo]

I agree with what you say Roy, and a system that would make you wonder how it all balances out when they actually read the meter. But I do understand how somethings work or don't work in Bali. Indeed the figure on the bottom line of the Bali budget would be well below that of its cousin in Oz.

But I do want to understand the nature of power usage for the different levels of wattage that can be accessed. It is good to hear that Ubud has a climate that does not rely on a/c's to keep cool. I would add that we only have the cool cycle of the a/c running no more than a dozen times a year at about 3 hours max. The warm cycle would be double that for the same running time.

Whilst I'm here and thinking of it, it amazes me with the design of Balinese homes that a roof guttering system is not installed to catch valuable drinking water. Is there a reason for this, besides the obvious lack of space on some of the small sized blocks and that some roofs are made of asbestos?

 

[Roy]

Whilst I'm here and thinking of it, it amazes me with the design of Balinese homes that a roof guttering system is not installed to catch valuable drinking water. Is there a reason for this, besides the obvious lack of space on some of the small sized blocks and that some roofs are made of asbestos?

That's an interesting point. The first island I ever spent a lot of time on was Bermuda. There, all the houses have a distinctive tiered roofing system designed to catch rain water and deposit it in an underground holding tank.

For most of Bali it seems that supplies of fresh water are not a current problem, but as you are likely thinking, that could change in the future given ever increasing demands for it.

Another consideration is that for many generations the sources of fresh water for the Balinese has been from its many rivers. As with the sawahs or rice fields, the rivers of Bali are viewed by the Balinese as also sacred, and their water is pure. These rivers originate from the most sacred mountains of Bali. Rain is more often viewed as nourishment for plants, whereas the rivers are holy gifts for the nourishment and cleanliness of man. If you think about it, you’ll note here that while the Balinese love to mandi in the river, they do their best to avoid being rained on.

One place on Bali that I have seen rain collecting roofing was in some of the most impoverished areas of East Bali. Another was in Nusa Penida, where fresh water is a very real problem, and rain collection is du jour.

Given the Balinese propensity to adapt, I have little doubt that if fresh water availability becomes a future problem in places where it is currently not, we will see more effort made to collect and store rain water.

 

[Boo]

I've been reading this topic with interest. We were thinking of building on our land in Bali but may have to reconsider due to the ridiculous cost of electricity for new supplies.

My husband has checked into it and explains it like this;

When building, you have to work out the maximum watts or kVA (kVA = 1,000 watts) your house will draw and order a supply which will cope with the maximum draw.

For 3.5 kVA to 13.2 kVA the price is not too bad.

RP 850 per kWH (Kilowatt/Hour) with a minimum monthly charge of 1,250 kWH plus 5% Tax. EG: RP 1,115,625

If you you need more than 13.2 kVA the news is all bad.

RP 850 per kWH with a minimum monthly charge of 6,100 kWH plus 5% tax. EG: RP 5,444,250

The RP 850 per kWH is quite good and compares favourably with world power costs. The killer is being charged for a minimum 6,100 kWH plus 5% tax.

In our case, we need about 23 kVA and will consume about 2000 kWH per month. But we must pay for 6,100 kWH

The is AUD$ 800.00 per month. The same useage in Australia would cost $340.00.

 

[Roy]

Boo, I don't know who you've been talking to, but what you wrote sounds nuts to me.

My very best mate, who operates two very successful and always busy restuarants in Ubud, as well as two houses pays on average about Rp 3 million a month for his electicity. We pay about 2 to 2.5 million a month for ALL our utilities...two homes, and a gallery. That includes city water at the gallery and one home, (the other has a well), electric, and two telephones, (with endless hours on the internet).

I'm sorry, but your figures are bonkers.

 

[Boo]

Hi Roy,

It sounds bonkers to me to.

It is right off an information brochure from PLN.

Apparently, it is for new supplies only. If you had your supply connected previously, the charge is vased on the old system.

After we heard about the new charge, we enquired with a friend who had his power connected a few months ago. He showed us his electricity account and it showed.

He has a 7700 watt supply.

His charge is RP 850 per kWH.

He used 230 kWH for the month as he was not in Bali much during that time.

kWH used 230
RP 850 x 230 = RP 195,500

Minimum useage charge = 1250 x RP 850 = RP 1,062,500

+ 5%

=RP 1,115,625

We were hoping it was wrong so my husband went to the PLN office.
They confirmed that for a 23,000 watt (23kVA) supply the monthly charge would be RP 5,185,000 + 5%

Crazy isn't it?

 

[Roy]

Dunno what to say. What it sounds like is that according to PLN, new customers for electricity can expect to pay two to three times what other current customers are paying.

Anyway, just for grins, what are you building that would require 23,000 watts? Most of us use gas stoves and ovens as well as gas hot water heaters. In our small house, we have 5,000 watts which is plenty to keep two televisions going most of the day, my computer, a washer and dryer, a microwave and a stove top oven. And come to think of it, our hot water heater (small house), is electric and not gas.

In our big house, we have 10,000 watts, but all of that has yet to be challenged, and for sure, we do NOT pay any minimum usage charge. . Anyone who pays a minimum usage charge of over one million against an actual usage charge of 196k is nuts. If someone tried to pull that on my wife, they would be leaving our house without their balls!

For more grins, I just called my buddy who told me that for both his restaurants (four freezers and two refrigerators total) as well as his two houses, he is on 15,000 watts total. As I already advised, his bill runs about Rp 3 million a month.

Something is wrong with this picture. Maybe you should consider hooking up your juice by way of a close neighbor. It seems to me that you could pay both their bill, and yours, and be far better off.

 

[Boo]

We were planning a large house, but this may need to change now to try and get the power supply down to 13.2 kVA

The neighbour option is one we have actually considered.

Anyway, the house;

540 square metres
plus 35 square metre swimming pool with spa
4 bedrooms, 2 with spa baths

What will consume the juice

7 x 1.5 PK (1100 watt) split system air conditioners
2 x 4 PK (3000 watt) cassette type air conditioners
2 x double door refridgerators
95 x 50 watt halogen downlights (transformer type)
20 x other lights
4 x (2 x 20 watt) fluro lights
8 x security flood lights
2 x desktop computers (24/7)
1 x web/mail server (24/7)
2 x Electric ovens
1 x microwave oven
Electric gate
etc, etc

 

[Roy]

A few more continuing points.

One, forget electric stoves or ovens. Gas is much better and far easier to regulate the heat when cooking, baking or roasting. Very few of us in Bali have electric stoves or ovens. In fact, I don't know anyone who has an electric stove or oven.

A counter top oven toaster, and a microwave for defrosting or warming, fine, but I'd bag the two electric stoves and oven and go for gas.

NINE air conditioners? And in a four bedroom house?

Hey! You're building in Bali, not hell! Sorry, but that is way, way over the top, and if you really think you need all those air conditioners, maybe you should be paying 5 million a month!

Take out those air conditioners and you just saved yourself 14,000 watts a month!

An electric gate? Hire a full time satpam. He'll be cheaper and can open and close your gate with ease. This is not to mention the impression left on your guests.

No wonder we've been having this discussion! Nine air conditioners! :shock: :shock:

 

[Norm]

Just a comment on Mungos suggestion about collecting rain-water.

The rainfall in West Timor is not as reliable as in Bali. On our last visit to family in West Timor, during two days of pretty solid rain, I noticed none of the houses had gutters or any rain collection system so I suggested it. The men in the group thought it was a silly idea because there would be no nourishment in any water that does not touch the ground. Any way, one said, "why bother, getting water is womans work".

 

[mungo]

Thanks Boo, you have cleared up the power usage issue for me. It is a strange setup in Bali as it should be pay-as-you-use. The potential power is always there. But if you compare what power you are consuming during the day it is likely that you would be close to what we use down here:

• (9-5) little power would be used unless you are home most of the day. We use approx 1270Kw (winter) approx 870Kw(summer) every 60 days in Australia, that is washing machine almost every day, upto 6 lights on regularly from 5pm - 11pm, elec oven once a week, clothes dryer 3 times week, two tv's on from 5pm -11pm daily, electric bore 4 hrs a week, at least one PC running from mains for 6 hrs day, r/c a/c 4-8 hrs a week in winter, electric kettle 1hr week, about the same in summer, microwave 3 times a week for total 15 mins, electric tools 1 hour week.
  
  Roy, interesting about the water situation in Bali. We use a lot of the bottled type when we are there and I wondered how you get along with drinking water. It seems to me that when it rains up there it really buckets down and a lot of areas get a bit of a flood going, which you would think there was better place for the pure sacred stuff to end up.
  
  Norm, sounds like a case of leading a horse to water can't get him to drink. :l:

 

[Boo]

Hi Mungo,

I agree, a pay as you go system would seem more appropriate.

Even though we were thinking of four bedrooms, most of the time only one bedroom would be used except when family and friends were visiting.
In effect, we would be paying the higher charge all year round, just to have the ability to draw more at certain times. Even when we did want to draw more power we would not use 6,100 kWH in a month although we would have to pay for 6,100 kVA minimum useage every month.

We were also told that the power line into the meter is the same and the only difference is the size of the cut-out switch installed by the electricity company.

 

[Norm]

Just a thought that may not be relevant. Is there any possibility that they are effectively amortizing the capital cost of upgrading the system to cope with increased demand? In other words charging more for ongoing use because they know the up front cost would be excessive?

Last year our company built an another aged care facility. We were charged $85,000 to connect that building to the electricity grid, althought the power lines passed by the property boundary and there was literally 20 metres of underground cabling required. The reason for the cost was that the draw down was so high that the system in the area could not cope and the electricity authority had to increase capacity for the entire area because of us. So under the recently introduced user pays charging for privatized electricity we had to pay for it, notwithstanding the fact that we are a charity. But strangely our tariff for usage is less than the domestic rate.

 

[mungo]

Just a few more questions regarding electricity and water:

• 1. Because electricity costs in Bali ( as indicated on some of the posts ) seem to be almost 1½ times to double of that what I whinge about paying in Aus. and knowing the value of the Rupiah in Bali, how do local Balinese people afford to pay for their electricity?

  Bert: "I pay for 5500 watts about 1.5 million per month." Drbruce: "We pay about 900,000 per month." Sander: "we have 3500W and are paying about 800.000 - 900.000 per month"

• 2. I have always wondered about some the wiring systems I have seen installed in Bali, and no offence to anyone, they seem to lack an earth wire and proper insulating conduits. Do they install earth leakage cut-out switches in with the wiring systems?

• 3. What do you pay for water usage, do you pay an annual water connection service charge and do you have septic systems and/or sewerage ?