Divorce Timeline

IndoLoveInWaiting

IndoLoveInWaiting

New Member
Hi,

I'm looking for help regarding 2 Indonesians about to start the process of (Islamic) divorce.

They have been living apart for 6 years, both working abroad in different countries for most of that time. They have an 8yo together who lives with her family.

He has been home in Indo for 2 years now but has never seen his child at her family's home and has never contacted her in the 6 years - or provided any support for either. She is recently home now (2 months) and looking to get divorced.

She talked to him last week about filing for divorce jointly, but he wanted to try again with their marriage which she is not interested in. She told him she would file alone, without a lawyer, but he said he wouldn't agree to anything, attend but fight it.

I'm assuming she has good grounds to get divorced, she has witnesses too, but with him not agreeing (and this being an islamic divorve?!) approx. How long will it take to finalize a divorce? There's no property or assets.

I've read it could be a couple months - while others have said it could take years due to the husband attending court but not agreeing to anything.

Thanks!
 
Would having a lawyer file for her make things go faster? With no assets and most likely easy grounds for divorce, i'm thinking she doesn't need it and will be ok seeking divorce by herself.
 
You've failed to mention the absolute most important part : Is the child boy or girl?

If a girl then unless hubby thinks he can cash up big time from the "new" hubby for oiling the path to joy then it requires him to simply say before witnesses 3 times "I divorce you" and that's the job sorted, done (they wanted to change this years ago but I'm not sure how far they got - laws in Jakarta change but the rest of Indo cares not a bit.

If the child is a boy you are probably in for a world of hurt and should really go straight to asking him how much he wants to agree the divorce, presuming mom wishes to hang onto the child.
 
I
IndoLoveInWaiting said:
Would having a lawyer file for her make things go faster? With no assets and most likely easy grounds for divorce, i'm thinking she doesn't need it and will be ok seeking divorce by herself.
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I'm curious about this drama. So far it is all one sided for the woman. You say he has never seen the the child or given any support. Was the wife's family open for him to see the child? You say he didn't contact her for six years. Did she try to contact him? I would have to hear from both parties, before I could give any suggestions.
Such a sad thing when people grow apart and have a child between them.
You say they both have been living abroad and working independently. So obviously she has made money also. Why is it, the man is supposed to play this role of provider even if they separate? I do agree the father should help provide for the child, but why should he provide for the wife, when she has been living abroad, earning an income, and not taking care of the child either?
 
Markit said:
You've failed to mention the absolute most important part : Is the child boy or girl?

If a girl then unless hubby thinks he can cash up big time from the "new" hubby for oiling the path to joy then it requires him to simply say before witnesses 3 times "I divorce you" and that's the job sorted, done (they wanted to change this years ago but I'm not sure how far they got - laws in Jakarta change but the rest of Indo cares not a bit.

If the child is a boy you are probably in for a world of hurt and should really go straight to asking him how much he wants to agree the divorce, presuming mom wishes to hang onto the child.
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They have an 8yo boy. Why is that worse though?

My understanding is the divorce could happen first, then deal with custody/support. The dad has no interest in his son. Mum is willing to do 50/50, but knows he would never consider that and just really wants nothing to do with him. Sad but true.

I'm assuming you're saying to pay him off because the dad can possibly take his son away and cause problems?

What if it's as I mentioned. He wants her back, only mentioned when she came to ask for divorce, but not interested in raising the son alone. He wants to fight the divorce though.

How much trouble can he cause in preventing the divorce, assuming she has good grounds to file? What would you guess on timeline?
 
Shadrach said:
I

I'm curious about this drama. So far it is all one sided for the woman. You say he has never seen the the child or given any support. Was the wife's family open for him to see the child? You say he didn't contact her for six years. Did she try to contact him? I would have to hear from both parties, before I could give any suggestions.
Such a sad thing when people grow apart and have a child between them.
You say they both have been living abroad and working independently. So obviously she has made money also. Why is it, the man is supposed to play this role of provider even if they separate? I do agree the father should help provide for the child, but why should he provide for the wife, when she has been living abroad, earning an income, and not taking care of the child either?
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They married and moved in with his family, but then he treated her bad and his family did too. So she moved back with her family and son. She'll have witnesses to attest to this treatment. He then took off without saying anything and started working abroad. After a year and receiving no help or support from him, she was then forced to go work abroad too to support her son while her family cared for him.

She did contact his family to let them know she was going and son was down the street with her parents. She also reached out to him several times by phone and Facebook throughout the years. But he was never interested to talking and never reached out himself. She was always hopeful he would call, show some interest, save the marriage, but no. In the last year of her work contract, she had made up her mind that she wanted a divorce. No longer wanted to wait and would file when she returned home.

Despite Islamic marriage rules, he never supported her or their son. Nothing. So she was forced to then work and support herself and son. Her job covered flight, housing and food. So she spent some on herself but the majority was sent back to her family to support her son.

All of this is well documented, so while I understand your concern only hearing one side - let's assume I'm telling the truth...

He's been home years now and knows he could've easily gone seen his son but was not interested. She's been back several months and he still never contacted or reached out. It's a small village and they live down the road from each other. Her father passed, funeral, 40 day event.. his family reached out but he didn't go out call. Nothing until last week when she went to his house to talk about divorce. He just said he wanted her back, nothing about their son, but she said no way. She let him know she would file the Divorce Claim, and he was mad saying he won't agree to anything and will fight it. Again never reaching out or asking about son this week.

His treatment, his family's treatment, leaving her, zero support, 6 years of never contacting her or son, irreconcilable differences... divorce grounds shouldn't be an issue. And him going after son really wouldn't happen. But I'm guessing he will attend court to fight it throughout.

Does she need a lawyer? She's smart and I think she can stay focused, leave emotions out and handle it business like. Would it make the process faster? How long do you think it would take to finalize the divorce?

Any other issues or concerns she should have?
Thanks!
 
Coming on here and asking a bunch of crusty old , cynical people is probably not the best advise.

I would STRONGLY suggest she gets a good lawyer. Yes it's probably expensive but if she rocks up to court on her own he will think he has the upper hand.

If she rocks up to court with a well dressed and respectable Lawyer plus a bunch of witnesses then he will probably fold.

Do NOT tell him you are getting a Lawyer. Surprise is everything and he will not be prepared.

Remember the 5 P's

Poor Preparation gets Piss Poor Performance...

Cheers
Ken
 
gtrken said:
Coming on here and asking a bunch of crusty old , cynical people is probably not the best advise.

I would STRONGLY suggest she gets a good lawyer. Yes it's probably expensive but if she rocks up to court on her own he will think he has the upper hand.

If she rocks up to court with a well dressed and respectable Lawyer plus a bunch of witnesses then he will probably fold.

Do NOT tell him you are getting a Lawyer. Surprise is everything and he will not be prepared.

Remember the 5 P's

Poor Preparation gets Piss Poor Performance...

Cheers
Ken
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Thanks Ken!

I appreciate your response, and thinking now, I do agree with you. Having a lawyer may not be necessarily needed, but when the risk is he'll fight the whole way; may scare him into folding early. And even if it is unaffordable all the way through, she'll find out soon enough if the lawyer scare works.

Do you agree on trying to pay ex out into filing a joint divorce? Seems odd to me when she'll get it eventually - Not sure what that would cost...

I only have experience with Canadian divorce, but is it the same where offers to settle are made and then the losing party will be ordered to pay the (lawyer) costs of the successful party?

I've heard timelines for a divorce order in 3 months and others taking 2 years when the husband fights everything all the way through... not sure if that was because of assets which isn't the case here... what's your guess on how long this might take?

- I definitely understand the risk of asking strangers on the internet legal questions. More just interested on everyone's opinion on timelines to finalize divorce... and whether anyone has similar experiences filing an Islamic Divorce Claim against the husband.

All the best!
Adam
 
I
gtrken said:
Coming on here and asking a bunch of crusty old , cynical people is probably not the best advise.

I would STRONGLY suggest she gets a good lawyer. Yes it's probably expensive but if she rocks up to court on her own he will think he has the upper hand.

If she rocks up to court with a well dressed and respectable Lawyer plus a bunch of witnesses then he will probably fold.

Do NOT tell him you are getting a Lawyer. Surprise is everything and he will not be prepared.

Remember the 5 P's

Poor Preparation gets Piss Poor Performance...

Cheers
Ken
Click to expand...
I agree with Ken. Don't forget to have a large pile of rupiah for "expediting fees". If time is of the essence, this will be needed to get a court date sooner than much-much later.
 
I don't know what that means though.

How much is the going rate to pay off an ex to agree to joint filing?

How much is the large pile for expediting fees? Is that on top of lawyer fees?

What is a regular timeline for a one sided divorce, while the other still attends?

What is a regular timeline if the other side doesn't show?

If the large pile of expediting fees are payed (must that be through a lawyer or no? ) , then what is that timeline?

What's considered sooner vs much much later court date?

Are the courts in Jakarta backed up, long wait for dates?

~ I'm not looking for exact numbers but general ball park guesses would help, so we had a little idea of what may be...

Thanks!
 
IndoLoveInWaiting said:
I don't know what that means though.

How much is the going rate to pay off an ex to agree to joint filing?

How much is the large pile for expediting fees? Is that on top of lawyer fees?

What is a regular timeline for a one sided divorce, while the other still attends?

What is a regular timeline if the other side doesn't show?

If the large pile of expediting fees are payed (must that be through a lawyer or no? ) , then what is that timeline?

What's considered sooner vs much much later court date?

Are the courts in Jakarta backed up, long wait for dates?

~ I'm not looking for exact numbers but general ball park guesses would help, so we had a little idea of what may be...

Thanks!
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A lawyer will have all of the answers and knows how to navigate the process. Finding a connected lawyer is the key. I have no experience w/ family law lawyers in Indonesia, but maybe someone in the peanut gallery has a suggestion.
 
Possibly a silly question but why do you both even care if she's divorced? Sounds like you already have all the benefits but none of the responsibilities.

If it aint broke don't fix it.

Please, please don't say you then want to get married? If that's the case (and I pray it's not, for your sake) then take 100 juta and show it to hubby offer him half to file for divorce and the other half when it's completed. You'll pay that much for lawyers and court time, if not more, and hubby could very well win. Don't forget this is a masculine society (why many of us love it).
 
Markit said:
Possibly a silly question but why do you both even care if she's divorced? Sounds like you already have all the benefits but none of the responsibilities.

If it aint broke don't fix it.

Please, please don't say you then want to get married? If that's the case (and I pray it's not, for your sake) then take 100 juta and show it to hubby offer him half to file for divorce and the other half when it's completed. You'll pay that much for lawyers and court time, if not more, and hubby could very well win. Don't forget this is a masculine society (why many of us love it).
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No benefits yet...We've never met in person, only speaking for months on text and video call everyday. Although our families are close now, until she's finalized - traveling and meeting in person is not an option.

We do hope to marry one day, but recognize a lot more is needed before that's an option. Once she is officially divorced, then we could travel and spend time together in both our countries. This is where we'll truly get to know each other and know for sure whether marriage is right and how that might look.

Being Muslim and in their situation, she will get custody. Divorce is pretty certain as well given their history. Timeline is the only issue, but based on my research I believe it would be under a year. She has already filed her Divorce Claim now and their 1st Appearance should be in about 2 weeks - let's see what happens...
 
IndoLoveInWaiting said:
No benefits yet...We've never met in person, only speaking for months on text and video call everyday. Although our families are close now, until she's finalized - traveling and meeting in person is not an option.

We do hope to marry one day, but recognize a lot more is needed before that's an option. Once she is officially divorced, then we could travel and spend time together in both our countries. This is where we'll truly get to know each other and know for sure whether marriage is right and how that might look.

Being Muslim and in their situation, she will get custody. Divorce is pretty certain as well given their history. Timeline is the only issue, but based on my research I believe it would be under a year. She has already filed her Divorce Claim now and their 1st Appearance should be in about 2 weeks - let's see what happens...
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So, you never met in person, don't know each other but you want to marry her ?

FFS mate, come on...... I know I am old school, but in 30 years SEA I have seen those "cases" so many times....

FYI : I live since 9 years with an Indo (Hindu) in Bali and occasionnally Java, both of us are still legally maried from a previous life, and we have ZERO intention to stir sleeping waters !
 
IndoLoveInWaiting said:
No benefits yet...We've never met in person, only speaking for months on text and video call everyday. Although our families are close now, until she's finalized - traveling and meeting in person is not an option.

We do hope to marry one day, but recognize a lot more is needed before that's an option. Once she is officially divorced, then we could travel and spend time together in both our countries. This is where we'll truly get to know each other and know for sure whether marriage is right and how that might look.

Being Muslim and in their situation, she will get custody. Divorce is pretty certain as well given their history. Timeline is the only issue, but based on my research I believe it would be under a year. She has already filed her Divorce Claim now and their 1st Appearance should be in about 2 weeks - let's see what happens...
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Ohh dear god.

Now I understand all the questions.

Do yourself a favour and do NOT send any money.
These stories are all too common and it ALWAYS turns out badly for the Bule.
Get over there, meet her and the family if you so wish. If she refuses, move on, there are PLENTY and I mean PLENTY of more fish in the sea.
Harsh, yes .
True , probably.

Cheers
Eyes Wide Open
Ken
 
IndoLoveInWaiting said:
Thanks Ken!

I appreciate your response, and thinking now, I do agree with you. Having a lawyer may not be necessarily needed, but when the risk is he'll fight the whole way; may scare him into folding early. And even if it is unaffordable all the way through, she'll find out soon enough if the lawyer scare works.

Do you agree on trying to pay ex out into filing a joint divorce? Seems odd to me when she'll get it eventually - Not sure what that would cost...

I only have experience with Canadian divorce, but is it the same where offers to settle are made and then the losing party will be ordered to pay the (lawyer) costs of the successful party?

I've heard timelines for a divorce order in 3 months and others taking 2 years when the husband fights everything all the way through... not sure if that was because of assets which isn't the case here... what's your guess on how long this might take?

- I definitely understand the risk of asking strangers on the internet legal questions. More just interested on everyone's opinion on timelines to finalize divorce... and whether anyone has similar experiences filing an Islamic Divorce Claim against the husband.

All the best!
Adam
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At the risk of sounding cynical, but also centered in realism gained from working and living in countries over the last 30+ years where outcomes are mostly dictated by who bids the highest, get the lawyer, be prepared to grease the skids, and sleep well at night knowing you're doing what it takes to ensure the outcome you wish for. At the end of the day, it's just a divorce you're helping push along and the funding of the desired outcome is not going to be too onerous. All facilitated by the lawyer so you don't get your hands dirty. Welcome to Indonesia.
 
I do understand your warnings and appreciate them, as I do share the same. Though I want to marry, I am in no rush for that. Rather we're more in a rush to start living together and determining if this is right for us and whether she is ok living in Canada ultimately.

Maybe because we're Muslim it is harder for us to proceed while she's still married. Her village is closer to Jakarta, close with everyone (including her ex) and Muslim as well, so just going to stay and see her there is not an option. Add to that the risk of jail for adultery, it's not worth it.

Once the divorce is granted, we'll begin the visa application and see what our future holds. We are close, as much as possible, but we do know each other, our families, friends and kids. I attended over VC her father's funeral, etc. There's no money involved, just really great friends with a hope for more, but realistic that much more is needed to know each other more and see if that's even an option.

A year longer go wait is nothing in the long run. The stories of 2+ years did scare me though... but we'll see. At least the process is started now.
 
Chris A said:
At the risk of sounding cynical, but also centered in realism gained from working and living in countries over the last 30+ years where outcomes are mostly dictated by who bids the highest, get the lawyer, be prepared to grease the skids, and sleep well at night knowing you're doing what it takes to ensure the outcome you wish for. At the end of the day, it's just a divorce you're helping push along and the funding of the desired outcome is not going to be too onerous. All facilitated by the lawyer so you don't get your hands dirty. Welcome to Indonesia.
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I would definitely prefer to spend the money on a lawyer rather than a vindictive ex. I am hoping that being an Islamic divorce, it may be easier on her. Kid should go to her automatically, as she can and does support him already. Divorce grounds should be easier to validate as well, given there situation.

She had help filling out the Divorce Claim with a family friend to review. We'll see what he does in his response and what happens at the 1st Appearance. Should it look like it'll be a battle, we'll get a lawyer for sure... hopefully it'll be ok.
 
IndoLoveInWaiting said:
Maybe because we're Muslim it is harder for us to proceed while she's still married. Her village is closer to Jakarta, close with everyone (including her ex) and Muslim as well, so just going to stay and see her there is not an option. Add to that the risk of jail for adultery, it's not worth it.
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Come live in Bali...
Far from the ex, the family and everything that goes with it.
And if you want to practice your faith, you can.

But yeah, I am a cynical, hardcore, non believer expat with 30 y experience in "fun" countries...

Wish you good luck, you gonna need a LOT of it !
 
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