Bali is set to charge foreigners 500% more than locals at hospitals

Rellek

Rellek

Member
One of the strangest stories I've read in the Bali Sun. A politician here has claimed that since Balinese traveling abroad have to pay international health care costs, Bali should do in kind and charge similarly for foreigners here on vacation and living here. Based on the article, this plan is being fast-tracked across the island (possibly) after starting in West Bali. I already know first hand Bules pay more at local hospitals but apparently it's not enough.

For one thing, skin color should not influence how much someone has to pay for healthcare to begin with, IMO. For another thing, how can Balinese hospitals and level of care possibly be compared with hospitals abroad?

But, what really makes this story stranger than fiction, again, IMO is that The Bali Sun is also running reports on the near completion of a mega state-of-the-art International Hospital being built in Sanur with the goal of creating a major hub for medical tourism here on Bali.

Good advertising..Our new International Hospital will be charging you 500% of the local hospitals, apparently.

I've said this before, I go to Jakarta for health checkups and care each 3 months where Bules and locals are treated fairly and equally and the hospitals are cleaner and better equipped with modern equipment.

Sources:

https://thebalisun.com/tourists-must-pay-500-of-local-healthcare-rates-in-this-area-of-bali/

https://thebalisun.com/balis-incredible-new-tourist-hospital-will-open-in-early-2024/
 
There's a couple ways of treating this idiocy -
1) since the locals are almost all covered by national health insurance and are treated for free does this mean foreigners will be charged 5 times that?
2) this "councilor" was off his meds and now someone will have taken away his keyboard so everything will go back to normal.
3) under the moto there is no such thing as bad PR this is possibly some attention getting act to bolster the super hospital in Sanur?
4) supposedly the travel insurance people will be the target of this since civilians caught up in the scam will squake the loudest and Bali just hates bad vibes in social media
 
Bali hospitals typically charge foreigners more than locals; Harga Asing (foreign price) and Harga Lokal (local price). From what I know this is not regulated in any way; so each hospital can decide on their own "policy" on how much they shall skin the foreigner or better; skin the insurance company in a far away country. I visited nearby RS Sanglah in Denpasar and was classified under rate for "WNA, KITAS/KITAP. e-KTP". In the olden days showing your KITAS card qualified for paying local rates for most things like hotels, entry to tourist attractions etc. Nobody seems to ask for KITAS anymore; they just look at you face before deciding on a suitable rate.

Many Indonesian hospitals and medical providers are defrauding their own gov. via the BPJS scheme, so no surprise if they also "overcharge" foreigners and their insurance companies in a far away country.

Quote from report linked below:

"Fraud in Indonesian national health insurance schemes can include
- billing for services not rendered,
- unnecessary medical testing and overtreatment,
- fictitious providers,
- double billing,
- coding fragmentation,
- kickbacks,
- multiple claim submissions or alterations to claims, and
-third-party fraud, among other forms.
All of these fraud modes exist in the Indonesian health services, with bribery being one of the most common fraud schemes. Perpetrators include participants; BPJS-K; health facilities or health service providers including doctors, dentists, specialist doctors, specialist dentists, other health workers, and administrative personnel; providers of medicines and medical devices; and other stakeholders such as employers."

https://www.u4.no/publications/tack...ion-in-indonesias-health-insurance-system.pdf
 
Shadrach said:
I fell and tore my rotary cuff in my shoulder and went to the hospital and had Dr. Wien operate on it. He was supposed to use state of the art equipment from America to fix it and all he did was scrap some Bursitis from the joint, and didn't fix my shoulder at all! Now my shoulder is completely screwed up and I can't lift my arm above my waist and it pops in and out and all over the place and hurts like hell!
What am I supposed to do? Suit him? Hah! The quality of health care here is so iffy, your lucky if they fix your problem. I think the guy going to Jakarta has a better idea. I think people are right about this International Hospital. It will probably cost an arm and a leg to get service there! And I can't see the Doctors being up to International standards! I'm sure when it's finished if you go there the doctors will be Indonesian and all the staff too! They don't like to import, just make imitation products with the foreign name( Marlboro,Nivea, San Miquel beer, etc.)
Do you think a Hospital will be any different!
Click to expand...
Developing countries are a "big risk" for health care ,we know that when we choose to live here long term . Even if we have crazy expensive healthcare policies ,we still have to face the lottery of local health care during the "golden hour" ,
 
Shadrach said:
So I wouldn't get my hopes up with this new International Hospital coming! They will probable hire the same quality Indonesia Doctors to run it!! Good luck!
Click to expand...
If they hired Western doctors their cost would be a huge problem !

Not even speaking about the work permit issue.....
 
Balifrog said:
If they hired Western doctors their cost would be a huge problem !

Not even speaking about the work permit issue.....
Click to expand...
If they were to hire Western Doctors, the Health care system should provide them with work permits for free! If a Western Doctor were to come here, they couldn't expect the make the same $ as when working in the West.
 
Shadrach said:
If a Western Doctor were to come here, they couldn't expect the make the same $ as when working in the West.
Click to expand...
That is correct. They expect higher salary. Expats expect hardship premium/allowance when relocating with families to third world or developing countries. Bali is no holiday if you have to work here and particularly so with the staff constantly off to some sort of "event".
 
Shadrach said:
I don't know what the golden hour is but I do know about the Health care provided here. There have been many times I went to see a Doctor at one of these Hospitals and even after they look at x-rays and MRI 's they still get it wrong and totally miss the proper diagnosis. I fractured my femur shin bone and from the bone Doctor I was sent to an idiot Doctor that changed the whole problem around to a blood problem and wasted a lot of my time and money until I went to a professional blood Doctor and he said my blood was fine, so I should go back to the bone Doctor, they wasted so much time that by the time I went back to the bone doctor, he said my bone had healed enough on it's own that I should just go home! I had thought this when I first hurt my leg, but went to these Quacks and wasted tons of money and time!!! The standard here is far from being adequate.
So I wouldn't get my hopes up with this new International Hospital coming! They will probable hire the same quality Indonesia Doctors to run it!! Good luck!
Click to expand...
fyi ,
The Golden Hour is the crucial period following a traumatic accident, fall, or injury during which immediate and necessary medical attention can increase the chances of survival for the victim. Do you know that most accident cases that result in fatalities can be averted? Yes, if the victim is provided professional medical attention in the golden hour, the chances of his/her survival increase multi-fold. This golden hour is the first hour following an accident.
 
Shadrach said:
I fell and tore my rotary cuff in my shoulder and went to the hospital and had Dr. Wien operate on it. He was supposed to use state of the art equipment from America to fix it and all he did was scrap some Bursitis from the joint, and didn't fix my shoulder at all! Now my shoulder is completely screwed up and I can't lift my arm above my waist and it pops in and out and all over the place and hurts like hell!
What am I supposed to do? Suit him? Hah! The quality of health care here is so iffy, your lucky if they fix your problem. I think the guy going to Jakarta has a better idea. I think people are right about this International Hospital. It will probably cost an arm and a leg to get service there! And I can't see the Doctors being up to International standards! I'm sure when it's finished if you go there the doctors will be Indonesian and all the staff too! They don't like to import, just make imitation products with the foreign name( Marlboro,Nivea, San Miquel beer, etc.)
Do you think a Hospital will be any different!
Click to expand...
Routine blood draw at Bali-Med, Nurse made 3 attempts to find the vein..results from blood draw showed I was cured of Rheumatoid Arthritis :D...Blood.jpg

I had bone-on-bone pain in my hand from the arthritic condition so the "very best" doctor at BIMC looked at an X-Ray and then eye-balled the location where he gave me an injection of cortisone between the two bones. (5 Mill Rp) followed by five 50 minute physical therapy sessions with rudimentary equipment at 700K each (I bailed after 2 sessions). Zero improvement until I went to Jakarta and got proper care. Kasih Ibu has the very worst Rheumatoid Arthritis doctor who prescribed the wrong medication which resulted in astronomical blood sugar levels which stunned the Dr. I went to in Jakarta. I'm now on proper meds.

All within about 2 years time. So, a 500% increase in health care costs for Bules, eh?
:D
 
I can see your point about more expensive Doctors! I had a similar experience with a nurse at Prima Medica, she was poking me like a pin cushion,I told her to get her superior and another came in and found the vein first try. The nurses were such inexperience twits I was shocked! I needed to go to the toilet with a broken leg so I called for help and one tiny little one came in and I told her to get another one stronger. They got me to the toilet luckily without killing me and were so embarrassed when I dropped my drawers, I thought they were going to run from the bathroom! I really think they had absolutely zero training about the male anatomy! The Doctors I saw didn't seem trained much better. Scary!
I think your idea about going to Jakarta maybe better. Hopefully they are more properly trained. I have my doubts!
 
harryopal1 said:
What was the cost for a taxi to Padang Bai?
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Hi Harryopal, well as you know I left from Padang Bai to the hospital and had to return. I payed RP. 400 Or 500, I forget. Anyway it was all a waste of time going there. After many trips all I found out was my CLL is not out of control. I've already had it for twenty years and it seems to stay the same. After being bedridden for two months with a broken leg, I have to learn to walk again. My legs feel like jelly so when I walk now it's like walking on licorice sticks. I am lazy and don't like to push myself to exercise my muscles. I know I have too, but it is much easier to be lazy!
 
The huge medical facility being completed in Sanur is being done under the direction of the world renowned Mayo Clinic in the US. Supposedly this is motivated in answer to the billions of dollars lost by virtue of wealthy Indonesians going to Singapore each year for medical needs.
Originally in the plan was there to be board certified physicians acquired to man/woman the staff from elsewhere in the world.
Subsequently I understand that has been changed and the medical staff sought will only be from Indonesia!
What inducement can that possibly be to the wealthy patients to NOT go to Singapore?
 
mugwump said:
The huge medical facility being completed in Sanur is being done under the direction of the world renowned Mayo Clinic in the US. Supposedly this is motivated in answer to the billions of dollars lost by virtue of wealthy Indonesians going to Singapore each year for medical needs.
Originally in the plan was there to be board certified physicians acquired to man/woman the staff from elsewhere in the world.
Subsequently I understand that has been changed and the medical staff sought will only be from Indonesia!
What inducement can that possibly be to the wealthy patients to NOT go to Singapore?
Click to expand...
And what motivation is there for a highly competent specialist physician who could make 6 figures elsewhere to come to Sanur? I think the standard will be low for the incoming Doctors.

Also..

Bali Sun News "The concept is to position Bali as a world-leading health tourism destination. The international hospital will be completed to international standards as outlined by the Mayo Clinic and feature the best wellness facilities available. The hospital will be equipped with 250 inpatient beds and dedicated specialist faculties, including cardiology, neurology, critical illness (ICU), gastroenterology, and orthopedics".

I read this as mediocre Doctors working in a really good and modern facility :rolleyes:

I agree mug, maybe in 10 years Bali will get there but right now Thailand, Jakarta, Singapore are all way ahead. You are correct, the wealthy will go to Singapore for world class care.
 
mugwump said:
The huge medical facility being completed in Sanur is being done under the direction of the world renowned Mayo Clinic in the US. Supposedly this is motivated in answer to the billions of dollars lost by virtue of wealthy Indonesians going to Singapore each year for medical needs.
Originally in the plan was there to be board certified physicians acquired to man/woman the staff from elsewhere in the world.
Subsequently I understand that has been changed and the medical staff sought will only be from Indonesia!
What inducement can that possibly be to the wealthy patients to NOT go to Singapore?
Click to expand...
I told you that would happen!!! Indonesia want's to keep all the money in Indonesia! Do you think they would hire qualified Doctors and Nurses from out of the country? Get real, they hate to import and if they do they charge an outrageous import tax (booze!) I remember when alcohol was a normal price then just before Christmas it was announced that a 400% increase in import duty would be instated. Great timing! All the large boats were just offshore waiting to unload! Everyone paid and have been ever since! That's what you get with the current form of government! There is no rhyme or no reason to this madness. Just bend over and take it!
 
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mugwump said:
Subsequently I understand that has been changed and the medical staff sought will only be from Indonesia!
Click to expand...
So the only "international" bit is the size of the bill at the end. To my understanding Bali already has these type of hospitals. What a waste of good concrete.
 
Rellek said:
One of the strangest stories I've read in the Bali Sun. A politician here has claimed that since Balinese traveling abroad have to pay international health care costs, Bali should do in kind and charge similarly for foreigners here on vacation and living here. Based on the article, this plan is being fast-tracked across the island (possibly) after starting in West Bali. I already know first hand Bules pay more at local hospitals but apparently it's not enough.

For one thing, skin color should not influence how much someone has to pay for healthcare to begin with, IMO. For another thing, how can Balinese hospitals and level of care possibly be compared with hospitals abroad?

But, what really makes this story stranger than fiction, again, IMO is that The Bali Sun is also running reports on the near completion of a mega state-of-the-art International Hospital being built in Sanur with the goal of creating a major hub for medical tourism here on Bali.

Good advertising..Our new International Hospital will be charging you 500% of the local hospitals, apparently.

I've said this before, I go to Jakarta for health checkups and care each 3 months where Bules and locals are treated fairly and equally and the hospitals are cleaner and better equipped with modern equipment.

Sources:

https://thebalisun.com/tourists-must-pay-500-of-local-healthcare-rates-in-this-area-of-bali/

https://thebalisun.com/balis-incredible-new-tourist-hospital-will-open-in-early-2024/
Click to expand...
As someone already mentioned locals are covered by BPJS, Indonesia's health insurance scheme. So also expats living here on various KITAS. So what ever charges on others would be for those seeking medical treatments here and price would need to be set in a competitive way based on service and quality. There are several other hospitals on its way but only the one in Sanur is with in a special economical zone. Foreign health workers can apply direct. If there is a hospital build outside of this zone with international investments foreign health workers may also be allowed. In Indonesian owned hospitals and clinics not yet.
 
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