Reject and Revise RUU Anti Pornografi/Pornoaksi

[Sanurian]

Spot on Bert...

...the number of Bali Expats, is far too low. Its a pitty, but as it seems they have something better to do then discussing things on a forum...

Believe it or not, I do have respect for the risks you're taking running this forum in the first place. Unlike some other expats who seem to see nearly everything in Bali as living proof of a "paradise" (on wheels, these days...maybe even on fancy handphones), I remain both skeptical and suspicious. The balancing act you're trying to do here is highly commendable. By your own admission, you're getting a little "nervous" too.

Of course, I don't speak for other expats here but I'm sure many don't want to say too much on internet forums based in Indonesia...just in case. So here I go and admit that I've probably said way too much in the past for my own future safety. Don't worry - I'm going to wind down (shut-up)...I worry a little bit for you, but you appear to believe that you can escape future potential "repercussions" by doing things like locking topics, and so forth.

Far be it for me to give "advice" like the following and maybe I'm being proactively paranoid, but maybe it's a good time to completely wipe your hard-disks and start all over. A real pain in the butt, I know. And even if you did do that, what kind of "forum" would we all have then?

The time might come when expats in Indonesia will be better off to publish their "grievances", or anything remotely "contentious" regarding this country on forums physically located in other countries. Of course, even to do that they still have to worry occasionally about what's stored on Indonesian-based ISPs (account details including name and address, etc). Can't "win" really...but being a tall-poppie here is not without its risks, as I'm sure you understand.

My last "negative" for the moment is don't get too excited about notions of democracy here. Most people in Indonesia haven't got a clue. Sadly, it's not even their fault.

All power to you, Bert. Don't abuse it, be eternally vigilant and all the best of luck.
:roll:

 

[Roy]

Sanurian writes:

My last "negative" for the moment is don't get too excited about notions of democracy here. Most people in Indonesia haven't got a clue.

Comments like that Phil, really do piss me off! An unfounded generalization, with no basis to support your very stupid comment. :evil: :evil: :evil:

 

[Davo]

I think all things can be discussed as long as it is kept inpersonal.

We can all put our point across without being sarcastic or insulting.

I thought the point of a forum is to have interlectual discussion and sharing points of view. NO ONE being right or wrong on spacific pionts of view, but gaining through the insights of others.

to think that you have all the answers is to me arigant and insightful, for all. :shock:

 

[mimpimanis]

At the end of the day, whatever the definition of "forum" all member's should remember that it is Bert's forum!

I would hate to see Bert pay in someway for any comments made here by members.

It's nothing to do with the moderation that stops me posting more often. Quite the opposite!

 

[made marko]

Being an American citizen, and still residing in the usa, I can fully apreciate anyone's hesitation to post on certain topics.
I AM on a 'watch list'. I had always suspected as such, and my paranoia was proven to be justified when I found myself intered @ Chi O'Hare last year. There were 4 S's stamped on my ticket. I have since learned that an 'S' means "social sedition".
I am no longer a politically minded person.
In the past I was a 'freedom rider' spending my youth traveling around the states, disrupting KKK rally's.
While Mr. Nixon may have had a file on me at that time, I do not think I was singled out at the airport for that distinction.

I can only assume that it was because of my online activities, ie. writing to ID friiends in BI, using search engines to access information in bahasa, and I am certain; my involvement in this forum also.
It takes no stretch of the imagination to think that the word 'expatriate' alone might trigger some interest to the forces that be - here.
It is an honor for me to be able to participate in our forum.
Bert's forum.
I do not question any decision he has made.
I have little to loose. I am here.
No children,
or wife.
Still, I fully understand the repercussions of careless behavior.

There are a great many sites on the web where ANYTHING may be discussed.
Plus, our mother's have certainly told us "if you can't say someting good about SOMEONE, say nothing at all."

I know my mother was usually right.

 

[mimpimanis]

Made, sometimes I dont understand what you say but when I do I usually agree!

 

[Roy]

Back on topic, there was a great “in your face” fashion show of swimwear and lingerie in Nusa Dua Thursday. This fashion show was to highlight the work of five up and coming designers from SE Asia, and the media coverage by all the major Indo networks was comprehensive. I can imagine the architects of this law were literally “stewing in their own juices.”

 

[Tommy]

I havn't watched the news that much lately but whenever I do I usually only see muslim groups (go figure?) demonstrating and supporting RUU . I've not yet seen any coverage of the anti-RUU, but i'm glad to hear that it's been covered. The RUU-supportive groups seem to only represent a small percentage of the population but nevertheless their quite extremist voice is heard. The issue is very much a matter of patriotism, as mentioned 'unity in diversity', and the 'slogan' of the concert was Bali menolak RUU/APP atas nama Nasionalisme.

Regarding the off-topic conversation...
I think the forum is great just the way it is. Without insults, compliments, off-topics etc etc one might aswell start a collaberation for a wikipedia instead. sometimes it's good to shut up but sometimes equally important to speak out. if this makes certain people uncomfortable there's always the heavily moderated 'so called' Bali-Forum where the grass is greener and the sky always blue. Bert, you're doing one hell of a job and I have no problem whatsoever with you locking or deleting certain topics for various reasons. reasons you feel are important for your/our forum.

 

[Roy]

Tommy, what is this?

I havn't watched the news that much lately but whenever I do I usually only see muslim groups (go figure?) demonstrating and supporting RUU . I've not yet seen any coverage of the anti-RUU, but i'm glad to hear that it's been covered. The RUU-supportive groups seem to only represent a small percentage of the population but nevertheless their quite extremist voice is heard.

Do you have access to RCTI, SCTV, or METRO TV? More to the point, what TV are you watching that covers demonstations in support of RUU?

Eri and I are truly "news junkies." When I'm working on, or off line, a TV with news from CNN, BBC, or a myriad of Indo stations is right next to our CR monitor. Neither Eri or I can support your tales of demonstrations in support of RUU. We've never seen them. That's not to say they never happened, but our view regarding Indo TV coverage of the RUU is totally in opposition to your view.

The vast majority of coverage on Indo TV has been in total opposition to this proposed law. Please, get your facts staight, or at least stay awake when you watch Indo news on any of the stations.

 

[Tommy]

Om Roy,
The RUU-supporters(mostly muslim women as I understood it) were telivised yesterday. One demonstration was in Surabaya and the other in Sulawesi (i think). Can't remember which channel it was...could've been metro or antv. Sorry I can't give more precise data. The point was not to dis-prove that the anti-RUU has been covered like you said but more to point out that I don't follow telivised news that much. To tell you the truth it's a 'rule' I try to live by, that is, to avoid tv and all the criminality shows aired during the day and only use it for movies, sports and brief news at night. I probably miss out on some coverage this way but i'm glad that you and others can fill in the missing pieces for me. (I mean it)

 

[Tommy]

Roy,
I was wondering if you could tell me more about the "anti-RUU" coverage as i've watched MetroTV and some other channels for a few days now. I have, so far, only seen ONE report of people who reject the RUU and that was from Bali (on MetroTV). So far i've seen coverage of demonstrations supporting RUU and against "pornografi" from Bandung, Lombok(not Sulawesi) and Surabaya. I've watched different news-coverage for about 1 hour every day and i'm not sure how our views of the Indo news can differ this much? Maby they air different news during the day as compared to the evening/night?

 

[Roy]

Agree. In the last several days, in fact, since about March 19 this subject has been quiet...not only on media news, but in the local papers as well.

I have no idea if we should take comfort in that, or grow more nervous.

Right now, all Balinese are directing their attention to Nyepi. Tomorrow, all in Bali will be very busy preparing offerings, and on Monday, it will be the great day of purification. The proposed RUU bill is the last thing on the Balinese mind right now, and frankly, the timing to discuss it further now is not a good idea.

You know, as well as I, that in Bali, there are times appropriate to consider secular maters, and times that are not. This is not the time.

 

[Tommy]

Oke. I look forward to read what you have to say after nyepi then. I'm all "eyes". :idea: