Husband rights

[CAP]

Hi there,my wife(Indonesian) and I have had leave Indonesia because of the continual hassle for Kitas etc.I got sick of the Singapore run a lot of years ago so changed to a Kitas but found this to be very expensive in the new economic era that we experieneced
I read allot that the rules "may" be in the process of change allowing a foreign husband to live with his Indonesian wife without all the hassle of either a sosbud or a kitas ,and was wondering if anyone could shed some light on this subject
I am also interested to here from other foreigners that find themselves in a similar situation.
Bye

 

[Feelhip]

Hi. I am also very concern. My Indonesian wife and I Being marreid for 20 years, are looking for a retirement in Indonesia. Where? May be in Bali may be in Manado, or Palu wher my wife was born. I understand the problem of being a foreigner in this case. If they (the Indonesian Government) could simply apply arule of reciprocity everything will be so much simple. I am French, and if my wife wanted to stay in France with me, there will be absolutly no problem what so ever. Why Indonesian Government do not look at the worl as it is today?. There are plenty Indoesian male or female married with foreigner, and most if not all cases they are welcome in their Husband country. What make Indonesia so reluctant to accept these mix marriage? I wonder.??

Philippe

 

[CAP]

Yes feelhip,Im not nsure why they dont recognize western men married to Indonesian women ,they say it is an old dutch law that has never been changed and also I think they are reluctant to change it because it is such a cash earner for the system and the under the table bribes.
Your choose of retirement locations is interesting,my wife and myself (if the rules ever get simplified) would love to live in Manado,it is such a nice place esspecially in the mountains .I spent some time there not long ago and it was very relaxing.
Ok bye for now .
CAP

 

[Roy]

It’s true, and sadly so, that foreign males married to Indonesian women are less than second class citizens of Indonesia. For Indonesian males, married to foreign women, it’s a lot better, so long as they remain married, and their husband remains alive.

As Cap mentions, there are discussion currently going on in the legislative branch of the Indonesian government. The Jakarta Post has, over the past year, run several articles relating to this, and the feedback from letters to the editor seem to embrace the need for changes in the law.

Malaysia made some changes in the right direction, concerning this issue, some two, or maybe a little more than two years ago.

The most sad part of all this, in my view anyway, is many foreign males, who marry Indonesian women, often are marrying the “best and brightest” and given local circumstances, move away from Indonesia, thus depleting Indonesia’s most valuable resource...it’s educated young women.

Philippe, in your situation, moving to Bali, or one of the other wonderful parts of Indonesia you mention, on a retirement visa, should be a good solution. As I understand the retirement visa, it is the next best thing to a full on Kitab, or residency...the next step on the rung of the ladder being citizenship.

Personally, so long as I can afford these two Kitas, and one Kitab for my three sons, plus my own business visa, I could not envision leaving Indonesia. Without question, our four visa costs, when combined with education costs, add up to our greatest outlay in living costs per year. In the US, I never had such costs, but on the other hand, there were other costs there that I don’t have to deal with here.

In my view, we all, in one way or another, have to be like an accountant and do a “cost/benefit analysis.” If the cost isn’t worth it, then move. If the cost is worth it, pay up and enjoy life.

 

[CAP]

Hi Roy,thanks for your balanced staements regarding this issue of western men married to Indonesian women.
Your absolutly right about doing a coat analisise and deciding one way or another.
Unfortunatly our 2 Indo kids and my loverly Indonesian wife had to leave after a very enjoyable 7 years,without going into detail we simply couldnt afford the combination of the school fees and the 3 x kitas costs that seem to always be up foo renewal.Weird really because I love Indonesia and its people but economics are economics at the end of the day,and how was I going to keep up the costs when I was in fact sponsering my self and kids.
But I will be back ........and I am monitering the progress or lack of concerning the statements that have been showing up on the Jakatrta post.
Regards and all the best .
CAP

 

[Roy]

Good luck Cap. Maybe you can kind of stay in touch with "home" here on the forum? All the best to you and your family. Namaste.

 

[irma1812]

Re: RE: Husband rights

The most sad part of all this, in my view anyway, is many foreign males, who marry Indonesian women, often are marrying the “best and brightest” and given local circumstances, move away from Indonesia, thus depleting Indonesia’s most valuable resource...it’s educated young women.

I completely agree with Roy. I'm not saying that I'm one of the best & brightest, but I'm Indonesian, British Uni educated, married to a Brit and living in UK! What a surprise! :shock:

I wish we could move back to Indonesian many many years ago. I would've been by my Dad's dying bed. Instead, I was thousands of miles away when he died and there was nothing I could do. I couldn't even come to his Funeral as my 2nd baby was just 3 mths old and was advised not to travel such a long way.

It's only now, after many years of hard slog we can start planning about moving there. Because we'll have the money. But I'm 40, my husband is 46 this week, I have 2 kids who don't really know their Oma (Grandma) very well, 2 kids who don't speak Indonesian, but worst of all........ my Dad's gone forever.

It really is time for Indonesian government to make things easier for Indonesian women with foreign husbands. It's tough for them to be away from home for so many years............... give them a break!!

 

[CAP]

Yes Irma,Indonesia is sure a hard place to be away from and Im a westerner !!!!!!!!
As you see by the cronology of the Husband rights link we as a family were forced to leave because we were running 3 kitas visa (Very Expensive)
My wife(Indonesian) was sponcering the kids but when the officials found that I was living there also they insisted that I had to sponcer them as a westerner which is mahal juga.
I am hopeing for not only my sake but for the thousands of western men and the thouisands of Indonesian wives that the laws can be changed ...........I mean all we want is human rights.....thats all.
Stay strong and its ok to dream of Indonesia Irma.......One day you will smell ,live ,and enjoy the place again.
Regards CAP

 

[Roy]

My wife(Indonesian) was sponcering the kids but when the officials found that I was living there also they insisted that I had to sponcer them as a westerner which is mahal juga.

Apa???? I have never heard of such a thing. How is it possible for a non citizen westerner to sponsor another westerner...even their own child? I think you were scammed...big time! Where were you living in Indonesia when you were told this?

 

[Richard Kalibukbuk]

That’s the main reason I changed my nationality due to lack of rights and uncertainty being a foreigner married to an Indonesian.

Lets hope the new bill before parliament will give foreign men married to Indonesians better rights and also make it easier to become Indonesian if they want to.

Australia learnt the hard way when it lost one of its richest citizens Rupert Murdoch who became an American. A few years later Australia recognized dual nationality.

However I expect this new bill will probably make things worse and not better. They were talking about forcing foreign men to place a $50,000 (not certain if that amount is correct but it was a large one) deposit in government bonds if they wanted to marry an Indonesian women.

So far the only good thing I've seen in the bill is that children will be allowed to have duel nationality until they are 18.

 

[CAP]

Re: RE: Husband rights

Apa???? I have never heard of such a thing. How is it possible for a non citizen westerner to sponsor another westerner...even their own child? I think you were scammed...big time! Where were you living in Indonesia when you were told this?

I was in East Java ,I was being sponsored by a company and the officials said that If the western husband is permanatly living and working in Indonesia on a work Kitas then he must be the one sponsoring the kids not the Indonesian maother under a "Ikut Muma" visa.
And yes I may well have been scamed .

 

[irma1812]

Re: RE: Husband rights

Firstly, it's great to see you on this Forum again, Richard! Welcome back!

However I expect this new bill will probably make things worse and not better. They were talking about forcing foreign men to place a $50,000 (not certain if that amount is correct but it was a large one) deposit in government bonds if they wanted to marry an Indonesian women.

I hope to God that this will not become law. But with these sort of crazy things, Indonesia will never get anywhere!! Why.....oh why.....do they keep thinking up these crazy scams??!! :shock:

By the way, Cap, thank you for your kind words. I hope that one day you & your family will be able to come back too.

 

[Roy]

I was in East Java ,I was being sponsored by a company and the officials said that If the western husband is permanatly living and working in Indonesia on a work Kitas then he must be the one sponsoring the kids not the Indonesian maother under a "Ikut Muma" visa.

That makes some sense. What it sounds like you were really being told is that your sponsor, (not you, yourself) should also be sponsoring your foreign dependents.

I think it’s fairly normal that companies that employ foreigners here in Indonesia supply and pay for the visas both for their employees as well as their dependents. So, this begs the question, why didn’t your company handle the visas for your Australian dependents as well as for you?

 

[CAP]

Now it starts to get complcated besause it was my wife that was sponsering me as her employee.........and also sponsering the kids as Ikut Mama,,,,,,,,,so when they said that the company had to sponser the kids it was in fact strange.
This is why we all hope the laws for forien husbands will be changed.