Looking at moving to Bali

[Vitas-casa]

Hi All
we are looking at moving to Bali any recommendations on good realestate agency ?
also trying to work out the Tax that we need to on property websites are all showing different amounts?
any information on how to proceed would be greatly appriciated.
Cheers

 

[britoo]

Hi All
we are looking at moving to Bali any recommendations on good realestate agency ?
also trying to work out the Tax that we need to on property websites are all showing different amounts?
any information on how to proceed would be greatly appriciated.
Cheers

Welcome to the forum and congrats on your big jump to Bali. It really feels like its getting back to busy again which is a mixed blessing.

I suspect you might have to provide a bit more info in order to get help here ie which area are you looking at, are you planning to buy, short term lease or long term lease or other?

Likewise for tax its unclear what you want to know, goverment sales tax on property transactions, annual property ownership tax, tax on rental income, sales taxes attributable to an operating business, made up taxes for freshly off-the-boat toutists. All might apply.

I cant recommend any agent, I am a cynic like many folks on here and believe that the phrase "good realestate agency" is an oxymoron but I would suggest:
1. If practical get boots on the ground before you start - lodging in a home stay or self catered arrangement for some months while you look. Then just look, look, look ideally while cruising on your motorbike.
2. Check out Rumah123, OLX indonesia and the facebook property pages for Bali and for specific areas (ie Ubud, Canggu etc if that floats your boat) of interest to you. Key words "rumah dijual", "tanah dijual", "rumah sewa" tanah sewa".
3 Relax crack open a bintang and enjoy.

Hope this was helpful though perhaps not what you hoped for.

 

[mugwump]

Having been here over 20 years would agree with Britoo. We all have different priorities, needs, budgets and requirements. So it is difficult to judge for others.
One thing that is worth mentioning is that the essential location in the south may be changing in the near future as a new toll road is planned to begin constuction in June, and upon completion will offer availability of options of locations that now could be deemed impractical for many. This will not only shorten distances to a variety of places, but create an expansion of shopping areas that don't presently exist.
Although you didn't ask for locations I can only assume that is the purpose of your seeking a real estate agent, and agree thoroughly with Britoo.

 

[harryopal]

Having been here over 20 years would agree with Britoo. We all have different priorities, needs, budgets and requirements. So it is difficult to judge for others.
One thing that is worth mentioning is that the essential location in the south may be changing in the near future as a new toll road is planned to begin constuction in June, and upon completion will offer availability of options of locations that now could be deemed impractical for many. This will not only shorten distances to a variety of places, but create an expansion of shopping areas that don't presently exist.
Although you didn't ask for locations I can only assume that is the purpose of your seeking a real estate agent, and agree thoroughly with Britoo.

You may find it worthwhile to go to "search" on this website and type in "buying - renting properties." A lot of interesting to horrifying information that will help you get a better focus. Good luck.

 

[Balifrog]

Do some "preparation" on line searches. Get in touch by mail with a few selected from your search. That will probably eliminate half of them, if you know how to read between the lines.
Then come over here for a month. Visit the selected contacts. But in parallel, search locally, hang out in pubs, read the local adds on line and printed.
But before all that make sure you know what you want, budget wise.
And if you buy, make sure to be aware of all the pittfalls and traps !
I don't know your age, but for me above a certain age (say 60) it doesn't make sense to buy.
All the best !

 

[Vitas-casa]

Welcome to the forum and congrats on your big jump to Bali. It really feels like its getting back to busy again which is a mixed blessing.

I suspect you might have to provide a bit more info in order to get help here ie which area are you looking at, are you planning to buy, short term lease or long term lease or other?

Likewise for tax its unclear what you want to know, goverment sales tax on property transactions, annual property ownership tax, tax on rental income, sales taxes attributable to an operating business, made up taxes for freshly off-the-boat toutists. All might apply.

I cant recommend any agent, I am a cynic like many folks on here and believe that the phrase "good realestate agency" is an oxymoron but I would suggest:
1. If practical get boots on the ground before you start - lodging in a home stay or self catered arrangement for some months while you look. Then just look, look, look ideally while cruising on your motorbike.
2. Check out Rumah123, OLX indonesia and the facebook property pages for Bali and for specific areas (ie Ubud, Canggu etc if that floats your boat) of interest to you. Key words "rumah dijual", "tanah dijual", "rumah sewa" tanah sewa".
3 Relax crack open a bintang and enjoy.

Hope this was helpful though perhaps not what you hoped for.

Thanks I guess was a bit vague with my questions... I have been doing a bit more research and it appears that I need to be 55 to move over on a retirement visa, so that is another year away.

 

[Vitas-casa]

Do some "preparation" on line searches. Get in touch by mail with a few selected from your search. That will probably eliminate half of them, if you know how to read between the lines.
Then come over here for a month. Visit the selected contacts. But in parallel, search locally, hang out in pubs, read the local adds on line and printed.
But before all that make sure you know what you want, budget wise.
And if you buy, make sure to be aware of all the pittfalls and traps !
I don't know your age, but for me above a certain age (say 60) it doesn't make sense to buy.
All the best !

Thanks doing more research .... we are in mid 50's so trying to work out the buy V rent but it seems the yearly rent is adv $45K - $60K year and buying (lease) for 20 25 years $250K - and over. which seems the better option. if im incorrect please advise more info cheers

 

[Balifrog]

Thanks doing more research .... we are in mid 50's so trying to work out the buy V rent but it seems the yearly rent is adv $45K - $60K year and buying (lease) for 20 25 years $250K - and over. which seems the better option. if im incorrect please advise more info cheers

45 to 60 K per year ? suppose you speak in AUD ?
Let's say 50k = 531 Million IDR : 12 = 44 Million per month ?
Something wrong with the math here !

 

[Mark]

Thanks I guess was a bit vague with my questions... I have been doing a bit more research and it appears that I need to be 55 to move over on a retirement visa, so that is another year away.

Stay tuned. The new "second home" visa rules are to be announced shortly, as in days from now. Perhaps you could qualify under the new framework, so don't give up just yet.

 

[AuroraB]

45 to 60 K per year ? suppose you speak in AUD ?
Let's say 50k = 531 Million IDR : 12 = 44 Million per month ?
Something wrong with the math here !

A couple of examples from villa search in Sanur this year (fairly new and modern villas 23-28 years lease):
Annual rental 24K AUD = 6% of purchase price 420k AUD
Annual rental 35K AUD = 4% of purchase price 850k AUD

 

[AuroraB]

Thanks doing more research .... we are in mid 50's so trying to work out the buy V rent but it seems the yearly rent is adv $45K - $60K year and buying (lease) for 20 25 years $250K - and over. which seems the better option. if im incorrect please advise more info cheers

If new to Bali some things to consider;

A: I suggest start with monthly rental as this will allow flexibility to move on in the event issues like these are going to be a problem (I mention from firsthand experience):
- Barking dogs and roosters (sometimes all night long)
- Smoke from people burning trash or burning the rice fields after harvesting
- Noise from traffic living close to main road (motorbikes & Harleys without mufflers)
- Noise from nearby karaoke, bar, pub, club (some not even identified on google map)
- Noise from next door house, villa, hotel, boarding house (parties, events)
- Noise from nearby business, metal workshops, construction etc.
- Dodgy neighbors often raided by police (my next door koskosan (boarding house) neighbour was arrested for murder…)

B: When looking for villa keep in mind there are different zones in more established areas in the south. Tourism zones near beach are allowing for all types of rental (daily, monthly, annual) mixed with hotels, beach clubs, pubs, bars, restaurants – some areas within tourist zones are tranquil others not so much. Residential areas are often villas mixed with local houses, small scale business, workshops close to farming land.

C: I decided to go for annual rental instead of buying because:
- Annual rent of a leasehold villa is typically in the range 4-5% of buying the villa. CAPEX saved is invested to pay for next year rental and so on…
- I can move on short notice (ref issues listed under A above or if required to leave due to force majeure)
- Villa owner cover agent fees, property taxes, property insurance as part of rental.
- Villa owner cover cost of major maintenance / equipment breakdown / renovation.

D: When asking the agents about any unfavorable issues with a villa or area around keep in mind they are paid by the owners, hence it is better to ask pointed questions to the neighbours in the area around candidate villa.

 

[Vitas-casa]

If new to Bali some things to consider;

A: I suggest start with monthly rental as this will allow flexibility to move on in the event issues like these are going to be a problem (I mention from firsthand experience):
- Barking dogs and roosters (sometimes all night long)
- Smoke from people burning trash or burning the rice fields after harvesting
- Noise from traffic living close to main road (motorbikes & Harleys without mufflers)
- Noise from nearby karaoke, bar, pub, club (some not even identified on google map)
- Noise from next door house, villa, hotel, boarding house (parties, events)
- Noise from nearby business, metal workshops, construction etc.
- Dodgy neighbors often raided by police (my next door koskosan (boarding house) neighbour was arrested for murder…)

B: When looking for villa keep in mind there are different zones in more established areas in the south. Tourism zones near beach are allowing for all types of rental (daily, monthly, annual) mixed with hotels, beach clubs, pubs, bars, restaurants – some areas within tourist zones are tranquil others not so much. Residential areas are often villas mixed with local houses, small scale business, workshops close to farming land.

C: I decided to go for annual rental instead of buying because:
- Annual rent of a leasehold villa is typically in the range 4-5% of buying the villa. CAPEX saved is invested to pay for next year rental and so on…
- I can move on short notice (ref issues listed under A above or if required to leave due to force majeure)
- Villa owner cover agent fees, property taxes, property insurance as part of rental.
- Villa owner cover cost of major maintenance / equipment breakdown / renovation.

D: When asking the agents about any unfavorable issues with a villa or area around keep in mind they are paid by the owners, hence it is better to ask pointed questions to the neighbours in the area around candidate villa.

Thank you very helpful

 

[Vitas-casa]

Stay tuned. The new "second home" visa rules are to be announced shortly, as in days from now. Perhaps you could qualify under the new framework, so don't give up just yet.

I will keep a lookout for the update Cheers.

 

[Vitas-casa]

If new to Bali some things to consider;

A: I suggest start with monthly rental as this will allow flexibility to move on in the event issues like these are going to be a problem (I mention from firsthand experience):
- Barking dogs and roosters (sometimes all night long)
- Smoke from people burning trash or burning the rice fields after harvesting
- Noise from traffic living close to main road (motorbikes & Harleys without mufflers)
- Noise from nearby karaoke, bar, pub, club (some not even identified on google map)
- Noise from next door house, villa, hotel, boarding house (parties, events)
- Noise from nearby business, metal workshops, construction etc.
- Dodgy neighbors often raided by police (my next door koskosan (boarding house) neighbour was arrested for murder…)

B: When looking for villa keep in mind there are different zones in more established areas in the south. Tourism zones near beach are allowing for all types of rental (daily, monthly, annual) mixed with hotels, beach clubs, pubs, bars, restaurants – some areas within tourist zones are tranquil others not so much. Residential areas are often villas mixed with local houses, small scale business, workshops close to farming land.

C: I decided to go for annual rental instead of buying because:
- Annual rent of a leasehold villa is typically in the range 4-5% of buying the villa. CAPEX saved is invested to pay for next year rental and so on…
- I can move on short notice (ref issues listed under A above or if required to leave due to force majeure)
- Villa owner cover agent fees, property taxes, property insurance as part of rental.
- Villa owner cover cost of major maintenance / equipment breakdown / renovation.

D: When asking the agents about any unfavorable issues with a villa or area around keep in mind they are paid by the owners, hence it is better to ask pointed questions to the neighbours in the area around candidate villa.

Is it hard to find new rental every year?

 

[AuroraB]

Is it hard to find new rental every year?

Depends on your preferences (area, villa specification, budget). I left some links below. When you start out you can see hundreds of villas available, then after you put in all your preferences you may still find a sizeable number of villas to inspect.

If you are happy with the villa it is usually possible to extend for another year.

If you want to move then maybe start around two months before current rental expire to search for new villa. If you rent mostly furnished it is a quick and cheap to move.

Some sites I have used:
English language sites [Here you will deal with English speaking agents]:

Bali villas for Rent | Quality Listings | Kibarer Property

Browse detailed Bali Villas listings for rent. Choose your favourite accommodation options; pool villas, home, or apartments by Kibarer Property.

www.villabalisale.com

Properties – Raja Villa Property

www.rajavillaproperty.com

English language sites, Sanur only:

Bali Villas for Rent Long Term » Balimoves Property

Bali villas for rent long term in Sanur, Seminyak, Canggu, Umalas, and other areas. If you're looking for a villa in Bali and can't find what you're looking for, please contact us and let us know your requirements.

www.balimoves.com

Home - Kubu Bali Property

kububaliproperty.com

If you have plenty time at hand here are some Indonesian language sites[Language can be an issue] useful for screening of prices:

https://www.rumah.com/

Jual Beli Properti Jadi Mudah | Rumah123

Cari properti rumah, apartemen, tanah hanya di Rumah123. Informasi lengkap dan terpercaya.

www.rumah123.com

https://www.olx.co.id/bali_g2000002/q-sewa-villa

Rent leasehold villas: Owned by foreigners
Rent freehold villas: As per law supposed to be owned by Indonesians only

You will find the same villa offered at different sites and with different prices...
To my recent experience; Focus on villas new on the market (new build, tenant just moved out, recently renovated). Despite covid; good quality villas are often taken quickly due to limited supply as majority of villas now suffer from neglect and/or location is not favorable.

Many owner will accept nego price and/or other terms. Some are pretending covid did not happen and still live in 2019.

 

[Vitas-casa]

Depends on your preferences (area, villa specification, budget). I left some links below. When you start out you can see hundreds of villas available, then after you put in all your preferences you may still find a sizeable number of villas to inspect.

If you are happy with the villa it is usually possible to extend for another year.

If you want to move then maybe start around two months before current rental expire to search for new villa. If you rent mostly furnished it is a quick and cheap to move.

Some sites I have used:
English language sites [Here you will deal with English speaking agents]:

Bali villas for Rent | Quality Listings | Kibarer Property

Browse detailed Bali Villas listings for rent. Choose your favourite accommodation options; pool villas, home, or apartments by Kibarer Property.

www.villabalisale.com

Properties – Raja Villa Property

www.rajavillaproperty.com

English language sites, Sanur only:

Bali Villas for Rent Long Term » Balimoves Property

Bali villas for rent long term in Sanur, Seminyak, Canggu, Umalas, and other areas. If you're looking for a villa in Bali and can't find what you're looking for, please contact us and let us know your requirements.

www.balimoves.com

Home - Kubu Bali Property

kububaliproperty.com

If you have plenty time at hand here are some Indonesian language sites[Language can be an issue] useful for screening of prices:

https://www.rumah.com/

Jual Beli Properti Jadi Mudah | Rumah123

Cari properti rumah, apartemen, tanah hanya di Rumah123. Informasi lengkap dan terpercaya.

www.rumah123.com

https://www.olx.co.id/bali_g2000002/q-sewa-villa

Rent leasehold villas: Owned by foreigners
Rent freehold villas: As per law supposed to be owned by Indonesians only

You will find the same villa offered at different sites and with different prices...
To my recent experience; Focus on villas new on the market (new build, tenant just moved out, recently renovated). Despite covid; good quality villas are often taken quickly due to limited supply as majority of villas now suffer from neglect and/or location is not favorable.

Many owner will accept nego price and/or other terms. Some are pretending covid did not happen and still live in 2019.

Thank you