ferdie
@davita: I disagree with your post on the whole bank shouldn't be PT, Banks in US also operated under US law, that's why US can forced UBS to disclose the account of US individuals involved in tax evasion far away in Switzerland. If the US are allowed to uphold their law, why Indonesia can't?.The main problem is power struggle, so I wouldn't even argue about the whole thing cause its too damn irritating and sometimes its not rational anymore:friendly_wink:@odez: labor market and property market and banking are different things, if you mistakenly mix them, you'll get your head spinning wildly, its like comparing apple with fish :biggrin:
davita
Ferdie....I kinda agree with your comment that it could be a power struggle.I'm reminded however...if someone has your testicles in their hand it isn't wise to tell them they are ugly!:love_heart:
ferdie
Ferdie....I kinda agree with your comment that it could be a power struggle.I'm reminded however...if someone has your testicles in their hand it isn't wise to tell them they are ugly!:love_heart:[/QUOTE]Welcome to Indonesia and especially Bali then, this place is so unique that some guys doesn't mind losing their testicles for minuscule matters, so they won't mind if its for their pride:highly_amused:
odez999
@odez: labor market and property market and banking are different things, if you mistakenly mix them, you'll get your head spinning wildly, its like comparing apple with fish :biggrin:[/QUOTE]Yes but all those markets are all connected ! This world crysis showed that !But OK I can be wrong in my statements + my english is killing me ... so back to the subject .. after all politic is a bitch .... and we are trying to stay nice :D
joji gulapetis
Whilst I understand how the Indonesian reciprocity argument is presented the info I read is that Indonesia is to enact a new law requiring all foreign banks, in Indonesia, to become PT. I understand this would mean the majority of ownership must be Indonesian, and therefore control would be in the Indonesian domain. Which regulated foreign organisation, in their right mind, would give up to this well known corruptive and managerial inept majority ownership? I would call this reciprocity reasoning "shooting oneself in the foot!" Especially considering, as JP Business News reports, that BI Foreign Reserves have dropped over 20% in the last few months....indeed, at under US$100B, it is at the bottom of the World Bank's recommended minimum for a nation like Indonesia. Today the JP Business News says the Indonesia Stock Exchange (IDX) plans to reduce the share lots from 500 to 100 to increase market liquidity. IDX consists of 42% foreign involvement in trading and needs to lure more investors. Maybe getting the money that RI corruptors/tax dodgers stash in S'pore, and put into capitalising the IDX, would be a start! Then........maybe small businesses, like the OP's idea, can access Capital and the Indonesian economy may thrive; rather than selling its resources.IMO....being negative about reciprocity is destructive. Much like my previous post on the result of the behaviour of my friend's nominee.I've just heard he borrowed money against what he thought he would achieve and now the lenders are after him...and, apparently, they can be VERY intimidating!Many Indonesians buy freehold property and businesses in Canada, where I come from, and also Australia, UK and others, yet we cannot buy in Indonesia. Where is this reciprocity...maybe Canadians and Australians should apply the same principle![/QUOTE]With all due respect, I don't think the US banking/financial industry can be held up as an icon to follow. Their blatant and open corruption and greed caused the 2008 world financial crisis. Indonesian bankers are way less clever and sophisticated. What the US big banks stole from their customers in such a short period of time makes the Indonesian bankers/corruptors look like amateurs. Maybe the Indonesian financial industry should get in some US consultants from JP Morgan to learn how to get into the big boys league. As far as the Indonesian economy is concerned, it is just going through a cycle, and the future prospects of Indonesia are much better than many developed countries. Remember, Indonesia only attained true democratic freedom on 21st May 1998. It has come a long long way in 15 years. In another 15 years it may become a bigger economy than many of the other G 20 members. So, folks, like it or not, Indonesia, with all its wrinkles and warts, is here to stay. The question remains, are we?:topsy_turvy::topsy_turvy::topsy_turvy::topsy_turvy:
ferdie
@odez: BTW which country do you come from? Is your mother tongue English?I'm asking this because your post is similar to a dyslexic person, no pun intended
ronb
[url=http://www.theguardian.com/technology/gamesblog/2009/sep/27/videogames-hollywood]Videogames now outperform Hollywood movies | Technology | The Observer[/url]anyhow .. it is old news .. I was reading that gaming industry surpassed movie few years back ! It was news back then ...[/QUOTE]Thanks for the pointer - he says that in the UK with combined software and hardware sales [for gaming] topping the 4bn mark for the first time: more than DVD and music sales combined, and more than four times cinema box office takings.[/quote]So, if on the one side we have $ spend on gaming hardware and software. To compare like with like, on the other side you would need box office sales + DVD movie sales + spending on downloading movies + spending on home entertainment hardware. So from his figures I am guessing the box office take was 1 billion, the DVD movie sales may have been a couple of billion , and then if you add in the hardware spend - who knows?Anyway thanks for the pointer to the article.
odez999
No. My mother tongue is not English ... Croatian ! Sorry for dyslexia kind of writing ... As long as you understand what I wanted to say its all good !The more I live in Indonesia, my english is getting worse and worse. Both in writing and talking. + I am becoming more lazy and lazy ... in other word .. turning into dyslexic person :D
davita
With all due respect, I don't think the US banking/financial industry can be held up as an icon to follow. Their blatant and open corruption and greed caused the 2008 world financial crisis. Indonesian bankers are way less clever and sophisticated. What the US big banks stole from their customers in such a short period of time makes the Indonesian bankers/corruptors look like amateurs. Maybe the Indonesian financial industry should get in some US consultants from JP Morgan to learn how to get into the big boys league. As far as the Indonesian economy is concerned, it is just going through a cycle, and the future prospects of Indonesia are much better than many developed countries. Remember, Indonesia only attained true democratic freedom on 21st May 1998. It has come a long long way in 15 years. In another 15 years it may become a bigger economy than many of the other G 20 members. So, folks, like it or not, Indonesia, with all its wrinkles and warts, is here to stay. The question remains, are we?:topsy_turvy::topsy_turvy::topsy_turvy::topsy_turvy:[/QUOTE]Joji...I cannot understand why you would 'reply with quote' from me, then offer the above. My post had nothing to do with your post. Your post #45 is a statement which stands alone...and with which I happen to agree.
odez999
Thanks for the pointer - he says that in the UKSo, if on the one side we have $ spend on gaming hardware and software. To compare like with like, on the other side you would need box office sales + DVD movie sales + spending on downloading movies + spending on home entertainment hardware. So from his figures I am guessing the box office take was 1 billion, the DVD movie sales may have been a couple of billion , and then if you add in the hardware spend - who knows?Anyway thanks for the pointer to the article.[/QUOTE]Anyhow .. I can say it is, or not bigger. I just read in the medias few years back ! Everyone were talking how gaming industry is surpassing the movie one ! ( i just said what I heard/read)The point is it is big business, not just in production of content (games) but on many levels already ! In South Korea you have one national channel dedicated just to broadcast World Of Warcraft gameplay/matches. (and thats already old news)In China you have gold miners in same game ! (google "china world of warcraft gold miners") Former IGN (IGN.com) owner from California made nice money outsourcing his business of WOW goldmining in China ! (back then, when it was profitable)My point was ... Indonesia will follow the trends ! Especially when HSBC bank experts, (I read it somewhere) said in some 10-20 year period Indonesian economy will be bigger than Japanese ! This is from Standards, but I read somewhere HSBC was telling some simillar predictions...November 18, 2010[I]London - The Indonesian economy in 2030 is predicted to be in the rows of the top 10 of total global economic power. In a recent report "The Super-Cycle Report" released by Standard Chartered Bank (Stanchart), stated that Indonesia even get past the Japanese.Indonesia in the next two decades will be under German, French, Russian, and English who are in sixth to ninth.Nevertheless, Indonesia in the next decade is expected to beat four countries. At that time, Indonesia will be in fifth place in the world with gross domestic product (GDP) US $ 9,3 trillion, while Japan's GDP in sixth with US $ 8,4 trillion.According to the Chief Economist and Group Head of Global Research Gerard Lyons of Standard Chartered, the report "Super-Cycle" shows the concept that there will be potential upside in terms of global growth."The fact that developing countries will be the main driver of the economy because the growth of trade, rapid industry and the rise in the number of middle class," Lyons said on Thursday (Nov 18, 2010)."[/I]
alex margou
No. My mother tongue is not English ... Croatian ! Sorry for dyslexia kind of writing ... As long as you understand what I wanted to say its all good !The more I live in Indonesia, my english is getting worse and worse. Both in writing and talking. + I am becoming more lazy and lazy ... in other word .. turning into dyslexic person :D[/QUOTE]Hi odez999,[COLOR="#FF0000"][B]Do not apologise for your English.[/B][/COLOR] What you say and write is perfectly clear to all of us here who are native English speakers. In my opinion there is no place here on this forum for criticism, veiled, direct or otherwise, of the English used by by someone whose first language is not English.It is unacceptable for anyone here to attack you for your English. If anyone out there cares to disagree with me on this let them say so. Let them try to explain why we should, in some odd way, want to look down on those whose first language is not English.odez999, keep up the good work you are doing of stimulating discussion here on this forum. Well Done!
BKT
@odez: BTW which country do you come from? Is your mother tongue English?I'm asking this because your post is similar to a dyslexic person, no pun intended[/QUOTE]I'm sorry ferdie but you're in no position to comment on odez999's english, his grammar is no worse than yours
ferdie
Whoa, i think i was posting a simple question and nothing else, the reason for the question was I have a dyslexic friend and how he misspelled his words really reminded me of her and bring back a ton of memories :icon_e_biggrin:
SHoggard
Infact I think more and more people wil lgo into places like warnet ! If I were living in Singapore for example .. I would ! Nevertheless i would have all necessary crap at home ! and BTW they do ! They have some kind of "culture" going to this kind of places ... especially if they are decent ...[/QUOTE]If you were living in Singapore & has a warnet you'd go bust in 1 week... every kid has a computer & most homes are now wired for fiber-optics, so those warnets that still exist are bleeding to death
BKT
There is a row of 4 or 5 gaming shops on Jl Raya Diponegoro in Denpasar, each place is two stories high. A few of my friends dragged me into one of them last year for a few hours to play some crappy team game. From what I remember it cost Rp2000 per hour. They had over 50 computers down stairs (smoking) and 50 upstairs, the place was half full, from what I've been told they only get busier at night time. I have no knowledge of gaming or how much these places make but I can guarantee you no one else on here giving you advise knows either. If I was you I wouldn't open another gaming shop if its going to be like all the others, from what I understand a lot of the people (12 to 25 year old males) who play these games frequent the same place so its going to be difficult picking up regulars if you're not offering them something better than their usual hang out. Of the few gaming shops I've been I've noticed they're all shit holes, maybe you might want to look at opening something a little more up market. It doesn't have to be like this place in Singapore [url=http://www.e2max.com.sg]E2Max[/url] but something a lot more comfortable. You might want to look at extractor fans as well, these kids smoke like chimneys. Also I wouldn't open up one of these places if you're not a gamer yourself, not only would you lose interest quick but how are you suppose to know what games to have on your computers?. In order to understand what your customers want you'll need to know which games are popular and what the majority of people want to play. The way I see it if you're going to start a new business do something you enjoy or at least have some knowledge in.
SHoggard
The way I see it if you're going to start a new business do something you enjoy or at least have some knowledge in.[/QUOTE]Spot on BKT.... that goes for all the other 'money making' ideas we see on the forum (bars, restaurants, guest houses... etc) where a perception of a profitable market exists in some country other than Indonesia... all the data and internet searches in the world won't substitute for [I]actual practical inside knowledge of the business[/I] of the been-there-done-that kind.Of course if it is viewed as a hobby (give-it-a-shot-&-have some-fun) then go for it.
hermit
My local laundry doubles up as a games shop.In holidaytime it is full from morning to evening with the same kids.Good bussiness?I do not think so ,because knowing those kids i am sure they have not much money to spend.If you want to start a take-the-kids-off-the-streets project it is a good idea to start a gamesshop.
ferdie
My local laundry doubles up as a games shop.In holidaytime it is full from morning to evening with the same kids.Good bussiness?I do not think so ,because knowing those kids i am sure they have not much money to spend.If you want to start a take-the-kids-off-the-streets project it is a good idea to start a gamesshop.[/QUOTE]Game shop? You mean a Playstation games rental place? I thought those kind of place is thriving?The one near Delta Supermarket in Ubud is always full with kids everyday.I think its the same with cigarette, if you like it, you'll never stop using it.
hermit
I am talking about the kind of shop where kids are sitting on the floor in front of a row of screens playing games.It might be good bussiness,but the place where it would be seems to be most important.
Fred2
The biggest problem I see is you are going to pay rent. Most of the local places don't pay rent.
