lumumba
Let me tell you a little story. Long one but I will cut it very short.I have a few joint accounts with my Indonesian wife. No problems here.Today I was going to open a deposit account in my name ONLY (for many reasons and too complicated to explain) for a large amount of money.Just guess of the outcome of this intention. You did not, ok I will tell you.We will give you a 9% net per year for a fixed period of one year if you open the deposit in BOTH NAMES, if you open the account in YOUR NAME ONLY you will only get 8.44% since the government will charge extra to foreigner: 25% tax instead of 20%This money just arrived from outside Indonesia = investing money in IndonesiaThis is a democratic country, NO. Discriminations, YES. But they like foreigner to invest in Indonesia...................They like to have tourist to come here: Visa on arrival, also higher tax on alcohol when china just reduce the tax to attract tourist........... My opinion on all this is: an absolute Fu** up.Now some one will tell me you have a choice; YES I do have a choice and this I'm going to do:I will send the money back. I don't really need the money here. I will loose on the bank transfers, fine I will not get poor for this.I'm acting on principal. They will never learn in a millions years, as someone wrote in another post.L.
hinakos
sometimes good to have a forum winge i think, despite the blind defenders running around telling you your being negative or its your choice to live here. i understand your frustration. try going for a round of golf in bali these days. white skin = more than twice the price. similar to most hotels that adverstise special weekends etc, its not until you get there that you realise that these prices are for indonesians/kitas holders only. in any other country it would be racist and your business would be taken from you. i think we just have to find a way around these things, or we'll go crazy. its twice as hard for me as my girl is western also, so we never even get the offeres that a mixed couple would get. makes living here as a western couple quite costly and often frustrating, but we seem to find a way around things and have a laugh. we'll be laughing soon when the crunch grinds home here and its a buyers market.........hang on till then :D
Markit
Many if not most countries tax the tourist (which if you have a white skin you are assumed to be here) for instance in Germany there is an automatic tax on every night a tourist spends in a hotel and is levied according to the registration on your ID card. These are the overt taxes the covert ones are food and booze prices in tourist centers. It aint fair to us but hey being born with a white skin is like getting a 6er in the lotto anyway so what the hell? Would you rather have been born Indonesian for the cheap golf? :lol:
hinakos
It aint fair to us but hey being born with a white skin is like getting a 6er in the lotto anyway so what the hell? Would you rather have been born Indonesian for the cheap golf? :lol:[/quote]sure why not, no reason i couldnt be successful just because i was born in indo rather than australia, AND get the cheap golf! :D "being born white is like getting 6 in the lotto"? maybe ive been here too long.
Jimbo
Or not long enough? All Europeans or white if you prefer are assumed to be rich and if you can afford to come to Bali as a tourist or to live there by Bali standards you are.The average price for a round of golf in Europe is how much? A lot more expensive than in Bali I would venture. To go and see a major league footbal game in England costs 600,000 Rp on Average. a round of golf even more so.Stop whinging at what locals pay and think how much more YOU have than them. Alternatively take Indonesian salaries become Indonesian. No....I thought not
ronb
if you open the account in YOUR NAME ONLY you will only get 8.44% since the government will charge extra to foreigner: 25% tax instead of 20%[/quote]I am puzzled by this tax. I routinely transfer funds (using Internet Banking) and get charged a fixed fee at the sending end, but no tax in Bali. You mention it is a "large amount", so maybe you have been pushed into a bracket that gets taxed. Early I transferred larger amounts (not Internet banking those times) and I didn't get taxed then either. Do others have experience with this tax?
chilli
8.44% interest and 25% tax. In Australia you would be getting 4.30% interest and pay 30% tax. are you saying that you will get a better deal in the country where you will send your money now? yours sounds like a good offer to me.
KaBIm
Just be aware that some banks offer a much better deal than the 9% stated by the OP for large amount.Bank Bukopin offered me a negociated 13,5% for a three months term deposit last month (for this month, until the next meeting of the BI's board of director they are still able to propose up to 13%). PermataBank, PaninBank, Mega bank are all routinely offering term deposit ranging from 10% to 12%.As a matter of fact it is much more interesting to open a 1 or 3 month term deposit and re-negociate it at its term, rather than dealing with a 6 month or 1 year deposit.
lumumba
Hi Ronb,[b]I'm not talking[/b] about 25% and 20% tax on transfer. This applies on the interest you will get on a deposit account.By sending the money back (done) I will pay again for the bank transfer (coming here and now back again) Hi Chilli,I will get more (not much more) but forget about getting more or less, you are missing the point. As a said before my action it is based on principals.As I said at the beginning of my first post it is a long story: the money was already allocated for a business that would have employed 12 locals. Now no business will take place. Only for a stupid thing like this? YES. Maybe stupid but not that stupid, not to me anywayKabin wrote:13,5% for a three months term deposit last month (for this month, until the next meeting of the BI's board of director they are still able to propose up to 13%). PermataBank, PaninBank, Mega bank are all routinely offering term deposit ranging from 10% to 12%.[/quote]Yes, last months, this months Panin offer is 11% up to the 4th of May.On this amount you will pay 20% tax in you are Indonesian and 25% if you are NOTL.
lumumba
Sorry, was 11.25% and still 11.25% up to 4th of MarchL.
KaBIm
Bank Bukopin still offer 13% for this month while PermataBank offer will be 12,5%.I am however puzzled because I don't recall having been charged 25% on deposito's that I opened on my sole name. However, there is quite long time (more than 4 years) it did not happen and most of the time, my wife (WNI) and I open deposito's under both of our names. Or maybe it is a "new" regulation :?: Did you get the same answer in any bank ?
gilbert de jong
You said it's based on principal...wondering how those twelve would be employees would think about your principals?I mean...in your post you mention a difference of 0,56%, if you then(for example) on a 100.000 USD deposit, wrather choose to send it back for e mhere 560 USD difference, amazes me.friendly greetings....Gilbert.
chilli
it is like cutting off your nose to spite your face, but in this case 12 others faces.What is more important, your principle or 12 peoples life ?
lumumba
In this case my Principals, since the project up to 2 days ago was only on paper and no one was contacted.Still, 12 people could have ................but then again if someone has to be blamed is the government. One day they will learn, but maybe will be toooooooooo late, not for me that is for sure.560 USD difference, amazes me.[/quote] Me too and much more than youL.
lumumba
Kabim wroteOr maybe it is a "new" regulation :?: Did you get the same answer in any bank ?[/quote]I did not contact other Banks, everything was set up b4, first they told me 20% tax, when the money arrived they told me it is 25% only because you are not [b]INDONESIAN[/b] and I quote once again [b]INDONESIA [/b]and this p******* me REALLY off.L
mimpimanis
Its the way it is here.There is descrimination - against women, against foreigners.I was charged 1.6 million per night for a hospital room that cost a fraction of that for a local.When I see a general doctor in Kasih Ibu - With my KITAS it costs me Rp250,000. Without it would be Rp500,000. However for my son who is Indonesian it is only Rp25,000. I Look on it as those that can afford more ( and lets face it for the most part - we can) are subsidising those that can't.
tintin
Further discrimination? Hotels provide contract rates to travel agents, which are lower than their published, or rack rates. In this way, the travel agents get their commissions and remain competitive. In Bali, most high-end hotels give different contract rates for different markets (Japan, Europe, USA, China, etc). :wink:
KaBIm
Hotels provide contract rates to travel agents, which are lower than their published, or rack rates. In this way, the travel agents get their commissions and remain competitive. In Bali, most high-end hotels give different contract rates for different markets (Japan, Europe, USA, China, etc). :wink:[/quote]I am afraid that this is not a balinese or indonesian specificity. My very first business was a touroperating business. We always negociated F.I.T. rates with hotels all over the world, which were about 20% to 60% lower than the rack rate, which allowed us to apply a mark up, but still remaining slightly less expensive than the published rate of the hotel. These F.I.T rates are known by any touroperator and vary depending on the market you are working with (ie: middle east, asia, europa...etc). Thus a given hotel can be sold at very different rates depending where you buy it. It has an economical reason for it. As anyone knows, it is not good to be dependant of a single market. By having a different pricing on different markets, you regulate this problem and secure a constant level of occupancy. Call it discrimination if you want, I don't.
Markit
I Look on it as those that can afford more ( and lets face it for the most part - we can) are subsidising those that can't.[/quote]That would be sort of acceptable - sort of, but only if you knew that the extra was in fact going to the poor. My problem with all this is that it most probably isn't going anywhere near the poor but straight into the head doctors trust fund. That is what I consider endemic corruption, not your traffic cop skimming off the occasional 5000 Rupiah for him and his kids. The doctors trust fund goes on with the connivance of the powers that be in the full knowledge that they will also be treated with exception both at the hospital and with regards to their own trust funds.
gilbert de jong
Hi lumumba,It's not the difference that amazes me, but you choosing to send that money back!! instead of starting the business..therefor a good influence on 12 peoples lives, and that difference you can write that off your books? No loss but a taxcut. Friendly greetings...........Gilbert.
