BaliLife
[quote]Bush and Cheney should be impeached and rather than looking forward to being John Insane's......er, McCain's running mate, Mitt Romney should be sporting an optic orange jumpsuit and staring at the world from the inside of a cage.[/quote]
:-) you're living in a democracy my friend.. "The oldest democracy in the world" as mr powell once said, right before he announced to the UN Security Council your country was going to take unilateral action against iraq.. I'm a macro kinda guy, so the leaders Americans have are the leaders Americans chose in my view :-(
I don't actually mind your posts, but when it comes to economic circumstance, they sound just a little too whiney.. I lived in Canada for 5 years - I never envied people living in the states, but I never thought, "oh our poor southern neighbours".. Your tax rates are superbly low, your gas is as cheap as hell and your housing costs next to nothing, compared to canada.. And I'm makinmg reference to your housing costs when they were at their peak, not where they are today, some 15-20% lower.. An average detached home in Vancouver is well over 3 times the price of an average house in the US.. An average detached house in Canada I believe is currently around the 350k mark - the US is around the 200k mark and at it's peak the Case-Schiller index was at the 250k mark.. Sorry sumatra, I don't have a lot of sympathy for an american screaming how hard they've got it economically - at least for the things you've outlined - but then again, perhaps I'm just a cold SOB..
Ct
SG
[quote]Corruption on the other hand, is caused by greed and fueled by opportunity, it's very directed and purposeful in nature.[/quote]
And has to have an illegal aspect to it, not just morally objectionable..hence the fees on your house and such really don't qualify as such as much as they might bridle (and as a property owner elsewhere in the western world I understand that completely).
Sumatra
[quote]I understand that comepletely[/quote]
So, you do understand that a dog is a dog, a horse is a horse, right is right, wrong is wrong and corruption is corruption whether legislated into being right or perpetrated outside the law? :D
Sumatra
SG
I understand that comepletely
So, you do understand that a dog is a dog, a horse is a horse, right is right, wrong is wrong and corruption is corruption whether legislated into being right or perpetrated outside the law? :D
Sumatra
No but I understand that you are happily comparing apples with oranges without being able to work out the difference.
There needs to be an illegal aspect to it to be defined as corruption.
http://www.anticorruption.info/corr_def.htm
It's not that hard....
don
I formerely knew a lady in Bandung who earned her living as an agent for foreigners purchasing textiles. Her income was quite good by Indonesian standards while her husband earned about 200,000rp. per month as a clerk for the government. He was willing to earn this low salary for years while looking forward to the day when through promotion he would eventually be in a position where his signature would be required on some document. At that future time he would be able to sell that signature. If some one were to gain premission to have or do something requiring his signature his income would rise exponentially.
This is endemic to the political culture in Indonesia, and despite the current crackdown will require a total house cleaning and adaption of a new system to change.
Those of us who have been here any length of time know that this is the case and those that refute it have motives for doing so beyond my understanding.
Has anyone ever travelled throughout the country and stayed in hotels and not wondered how in the hell could such a supposedly poor country afford to be constantly housing and feed ing government employees? Are all those meetings and banquets necessary or just part of the culture?
Don
Sumatra
[quote]It's not that hard....[/quote]
You're right, it's not that hard.
Wrong is wrong. Just because generations of wealthy bastards have managed to velcro corruption to law, doesn't make it any less wrong. Firstly they perpetrate corruption while at the same time, creating legislation to cover their arses and make it look right, by the letter of the law. Aren't you familiar with the saying "Two wrongs don't make a right."?
Sumatra
SG
[quote=Sumatra][quote]It's not that hard....[/quote]
You're right, it's not that hard.
Wrong is wrong. Just because generations of wealthy bastards have managed to velcro corruption to law, doesn't make it any less wrong. Firstly they perpetrate corruption while at the same time, creating legislation to cover their arses and make it look right, by the letter of the law. Aren't you familiar with the saying "Two wrongs don't make a right."?
Sumatra[/quote]
Now you seem to be tossing conspiracy theories and generalisations into the mix. "Weathy bastards" have conspired to cover up corrupt practices..is that just a few "weathy bastards", or all of them?
BaliLife
Sumatra - give up buddy. You don't like it? Go live in Cuba - and see if life's any better when you truly can't own anything and no opportunity exists.
I've never heard anybody whine so much about taxes in the US - my god, any Australian, Canadian or European who understands how little tax Americans pay would be laughing their arses off after reading your posts.
You, like anyone have the opportunity to invest in property and profit from home ownership - sometimes the tides go your way and sometimes they don't. If you got in at the wrong time and are now feeling the pinch, it's unfortunate, but it's no-one's fault - it's just the way of the world. If you didn't want to carry the risk of losing equity through home ownership, then you shouldn't have bought a home.
Ct
Sumatra
[quote]Is that just a few "wealthy bastard's", or all of them?[/quote]
It's all inclusive, those who actively participate in corruption and those who could make a positive difference but choose to look the other way. Over 5,000 US troops have died in the current Iraqi debacle but miraculously, no children of congressional representatives (535) have gone down. For that matter, none of their children bit the bullet in Kuwait either. They all get cushy stateside assignments or, go on hiatus in Canada of all places. These are the same people who pass unjust law at 1:30am, while we're sleeping (THE USA PATRIOT ACT)
It's a matter of public record, not a conspiracy theory.
Balilife, Cuba? Talk about comparing apples to oranges. Australians, Canadians and Europeans lost their opportunity to fight back against government corruption and now you're all living in a socialist hell because of it. I'm just extremely disappointed that my fellow americans are quickly losing their opportunity to fight back as well.
Sumatra
BaliLife
Sumatra - I think SG has been very nice to you. Very nice and very patient.
[quote]Australians, Canadians and Europeans lost their opportunity to fight back against government corruption and now you're all living in a socialist hell because of it.[/quote]
You've bashed every aspect of capitalism over the head and now you're referring to 'socialist hell'? Which way does the gate swing for you? Going off your dialogue with SG, I don't have my hopes up about getting any kind of rational response - you can't even grasp the simplest of concepts.
Keep smiling..
Ct
Sumatra
Ok, I capitulate. Perhaps having so much experience dealing with the lowest common denominator on a daily basis has somewhat tainted my objectivity, when it comes to discussing the topic of corruption.
It's clearly evident that what I've dealt with over the years routinely, as compared to what your own experiences have been are quite different and are most probably worlds apart. If my posts have raised anyone's ire or offended in any way, I do apologize.
I only came here hoping to socialize and went off on a rant instead.
Does anyone know of any good inland freshwater fishing areas? :)
Sumatra
SG
[quote=Sumatra][quote]Is that just a few "wealthy bastard's", or all of them?[/quote]
It's all inclusive, those who actively participate in corruption and those who could make a positive difference but choose to look the other way. Over 5,000 US troops have died in the current Iraqi debacle but miraculously, no children of congressional representatives (535) have gone down. For that matter, none of their children bit the bullet in Kuwait either. They all get cushy stateside assignments or, go on hiatus in Canada of all places. These are the same people who pass unjust law at 1:30am, while we're sleeping (THE USA PATRIOT ACT)
It's a matter of public record, not a conspiracy theory.
[/quote]
See there you go, you are making some progress towards the correct definition of corruption as accepted by every English dictionary I can find listed online. If those Congressmen and women used undue influence to prevent to their offspring from serving in Iraq where some 4118 (not 5000) Us service folk have died, then that is corruption, but your earlier uses could well be regarded as a corruption of the language itself.
As to whether all 'wealthy bastards' are responsible, I'd like to suggest in the politest way that perhaps you have wee chip on your shoulder. I know plenty of 'wealthy bastards' that are neither corrupt nor grossly dishonest.
Sumatra
[quote]undue influence[/quote]
This undue influence is pervasive and it's not just used to keep their kids from catching a bullet. If a certain law doesn't fit into their scheming machinations, they'll simply abolish it, change it or, create a new one that's more to their liking, while still keeping themselves above board in a legal aspect.
You know every wealthy person over there and stateside as well? Wow, I'm surprised I haven't seen your face on the cover of "People" magazine. In 12 years of apprehending suspects for theft, I've collared at least 25 of them toting several different forms of ID., sporting their faces but accompanied by different names. Walking false ID factories.
If I bagged 25 of them playing this game, there's at least 250,000 I missed. Just because you claim to know many of the "well-heeled" it doesn't mean you know them all.
Maybe, it's time for everyone on this planet to "chip up" a bit and demand change, because what ever happens here and in China corruptionwise creates a ripple effect that causes a negative economic impact worldwide.
Sumatra
tintin
Sumatra,
Just curious: are you a US citizen? Regardless, how long have you lived in the US?
[quote]Does anyone know of any good inland freshwater fishing areas? [/quote]
Where? In Boston? In Bali? In Sumatra?
Sumatra
Inland fishing in Bali of course. What species of fish inhabit the inland ponds and streams?
Are they edible or, are they poisoned with a high mercury content, as they are here in the states? I'm and avid fisherman, casting whenever an opportunity presents itself. I carry fishing gear in my trunk all summer long.
By the by, I'm a lifelong resident of the United States, my wife is Indonesian. She turned me on to Balipod, sometimes she posts and sometimes I will, sorry for the confusion. :wink:
Sumatra
SG
[quote=Sumatra][quote]undue influence[/quote]
This undue influence is pervasive and it's not just used to keep their kids from catching a bullet. If a certain law doesn't fit into their scheming machinations, they'll simply abolish it, change it or, create a new one that's more to their liking, while still keeping themselves above board in a legal aspect.
You know every wealthy person over there and stateside as well? Wow, I'm surprised I haven't seen your face on the cover of "People" magazine. In 12 years of apprehending suspects for theft, I've collared at least 25 of them toting several different forms of ID., sporting their faces but accompanied by different names. Walking false ID factories.
If I bagged 25 of them playing this game, there's at least 250,000 I missed. Just because you claim to know many of the "well-heeled" it doesn't mean you know them all.
Maybe, it's time for everyone on this planet to "chip up" a bit and demand change, because what ever happens here and in China corruptionwise creates a ripple effect that causes a negative economic impact worldwide.
Sumatra[/quote]
You are not actually making a hell of a lot of sense now..sorry, and you clearly don't read or follow what others are saying. I don't deal in silly wild swings at an undefined "them" which I guess includes anyone who you feel badly done by.
Either way your posts seem to be degenerating into trolling and I can't be bothered trying to re-state the obvious over and over again.
tintin
Hi Sumatera,
I've never seen anybody fishing in the rivers I am familiar with, such as the well-known Petanu, Pakerisan, Ayung, Sangsang, Oos, etc. Up the mountain, the rivers and streams start nice and clean, but soon become more and more polluted with all sorts of pollutants, natural and not-so-natural, including heavy metals, the closer one gets to their mouths.
I've seen Balinese people fishing in Batur, Buyan and Tamblingan lakes. These are certainly not polluted, except maybe Buyan. What kind of fish? Dono
tintin
This is a follow up to my July 9 post on the subject of the "Big Dig," in Boston.
The project which started at $3.5 BILLIONS, and ended up at $14.6 Billions, and a 5 year delay, is costing even more. Few days ago, the [i]Boston Globe[/i] reported that the State of Massachusetts being saddled with 73% of the final bill (27% paid by the US Federal Government), borrowed money to pay for the bills. As a result, the final cost will be close to $22 BILLIONS, and will finish being paid in 2035! :cry:
I must agree with [b]Sumatra[/b] on that one: this "grandiose" mismanagement is actually grand theft (Jesse James, eat your heart out). in this particular case, it's too bad we don't live in China: a bullet in the head of several of the so-called managers of the project from Bechtel and Co. would go a long way to teach some lessons (How's that BaliLife, I've joined your thinking?). :evil: :evil:
Sumatra
I'm not sure how many bullets it would take to make this one right. Romney dropped 45million USD on his failed presidential bid just recently and he publicly announced he wouldn't be seeking to recoup any of this cash loss. What kind of nit wit flushes 45mil and isn't even interested in mounting any effort whatsoever to recover even a portion of that total!!!?????
Easy come, (big dig) easy go.(presidential bid). As stated in a previous post , this joker has layer after layer of willing (and unwilling) scapegoats keeping him bullet-proof, sort of like kevlar body armor. By the way, I think I also read a piece about him dumping 65million in a senate race, with the same flippant attitude about the money. Easy come, easy go, if you're stealing it versus working for it, cash is easy to throw away. :twisted:
Sumatra
BaliLife
Colorful, I assume you're not suggesting with reference to my name that I'm somehow a great bennifactor from corruption (well more than the average person who pays their way out of a speeding ticket) or that I am in any position of influence? In case you've got the wrong impression, allow me to clarify that I personally am neither - but yes, through direct and indirect relationships and acquaintances I witness the observation you made alongside reference to my name.
Your points on the detriments of corruption are right on and outline the cultural challenge facing this nation.
Ct
