Markit
Yeah and look at them! Need more proof that a European Union is a race for the bottom?
davita
The Scots will never join the EU separately as they would have to offer up the and take on the Euro and if there's one way to make a Scotsman think clearly it's if you threaten his dosh.[/QUOTE]And yet the first thing that emerged from the exit vote is the Scottish Parliament requesting another independance referendum. But what do you know!!!
SamD
I don't follow that logic RonB. If the Scottish Nationalists had a strategy to another shot at Independance surely they would have voted to exit. Remaining would deny them that route, as the status quo would be prevail, and it has already been established that Scotland would NOT have another shot at independance..[/QUOTE]Not true. The only scenario that demands another Scottish Indepenence vote is the one that actually occurred: A UK exit from the EU coupled with a massive Scottish vote to remain. If Scotland had voted to exit the EU, where is the logic in them then demanding another Independence vote? Based on what?So the Scottish Indy supporter has the massed ranks of the English working class to thank for providing the opportunity to call for another Independence vote, and this time I think it would be overwhelmingly a "Yes". The Guardian newspaper published some interesting statistics on the Leave/Remain vote based on higher education/formal qualification demographics. Basically it showed that the stupider you are, the more likely you are to vote "Leave" (Myself and Markit are obviously outliers). Now we have laughable scenes of remainers (mainly young) demanding a [I]second[/I] referendum because they lost. The poor little diddums didn't get what they wanted and are now throwing a tantrum and refusing to eat their vegetables. It will all settle down eventually and Britain will be just fine. Some will lose, some will win and Bob Geldoff will release a new single "I don't like Thursdays".
geedee
Yes, supremely arrogant! For my children, who still live in the UK.[/QUOTE]It doesn't seem right that you can vote.I know you have passport and lived in UK for 15yrs but that doesn't make it fair.
geedee
Not odd at all seeing that half the Scots want separation from England, and EU makes it much more feasible than being an independent Scotland with no EU support.[/QUOTE]More than half if you look at the last general election and Brexit votes
geedee
I don't follow that logic RonB. If the Scottish Nationalists had a strategy to another shot at Independance surely they would have voted to exit. Remaining would deny them that route, as the status quo would prevail, and it has already been established that Scotland would NOT have another shot at independance.As it is..... the overwhelming working class in the Midlands still managed an exit majority (sans Scots voting over 60% to remain) and now the Scottish Nationalists have already acknowledged plans for another separation vote.[/QUOTE]Perfect logic.This is a great vote for the SNP coupled with the last General Election vote it gives them a great platform to ask for another independence referendum.If it happens i dont think there is any doubt they will win.Both Labour and Tories made lots of promises before the last referendum which of course they never kept and their scare campaign worked.In any case the U.K is now very divided by age social , economic and location
davita
The rationale of it being odd is that the [B]majority[/B] of pragmatic Scots, by a 10% margin, voted to stay in UK so long as it was INSIDE the EU. The [B]majority[/B] voted on Thursday to affirm to remain in that status quo in a UK/EU by 60%..... in the popular belief that Brixet wouldn't happen. Now the [B]minority[/B] SNP have another opportunity, as SamD said, courtesy of the elderly working-class of the Midlands, UK.The obvious is that most Scots, Nationalists or not, do NOT wish to be controlled by the UK Parliament and now England will control Scotland (excluding the crumbs thrown to the Scottish Parliament) without the baffle of EU. I believe that Scottish Nationalism will prevail and Scots will vote overwhelmingly to secede from English rule, and stay independant within EU. Also, it is likely Northern Ireland will rejoin with Eire/EU and leave England and Wales to their own volition.The Britext vote has propelled the demise of the United Kingdom more than the death of the European Union, although that is also a hypothetical.The result is Russia and China will be more than ever united and be in a position to create the world's order in the future or, if Trump prevails...maybe WW3. Either way.....I'm glad my old-age will exclude me from that future. I was 8 when the last WW finished and know it isn't fun for kids.
JohnnyCool
Spain is now talking about shared sovereignty over Gibraltar so that the islanders can still be part of the EU.Scotland is considering another referendum on independence from the UK.There is a petition calling on the new Mayor of London to declare London independent from the UK and join the EU as a "city state".What's next? Northern Ireland to get out of the UK to join Southern Ireland?The time is well overdue for the EU heavies to listen to their all of their members and modify/relax EU requirements, (including addressing how members can exit if they choose or need to). A one-glove-fits-all approach was doomed to failure decades ago (IMHO). The current mess is testament to that.
davita
1.Spain is now talking about shared sovereignty over Gibraltar so that the [COLOR="#FF0000"]islanders[/COLOR] can still be part of the EU.2. A one-glove-fits-all approach was doomed to failure decades ago (IMHO). The current mess is testament to that.[/QUOTE]1. Last time I looked out the aircraft window, landing in Gibralter, it looked like it was attached by land to Spain...so hardly think it's an island. Maybe you meant Gibralter Island in Lake Erie (Ohio).Just kidding...many believe Gibralter is an island but it's actually a peninsula.2. Totally agree with this comment...seems the bureaucrats meddled in the nitty gritty of standardisation. They missed the big picture of creating a united Europe and obviate petty nationalism that is now throwing up its ugly response.Extreme national pride causes fights.
Markit
As the only person active on this forum that is remotely close to the UK at the moment I can happily report that the excitement seems to be much larger in people that aren't here, probably due to the imagined effects of Brexit. In London at the moment most people are bored stiff with it and it really only gets mulled over in the news and if you pointedly ask someone. As per usual most people can't understand what passes for English when the Scots spout about their new interest in independence and it's roundly laughed at with the addendum that Westminster first has to agree to a new Scottish referendum. In view of the last referendum I would not be so quick to forecast a positive outcome should the powers that still be eventually agree to one. Not that I need to explain my actions in any way but to calm the Haggis bashers here I voted in the referendum because I was actually born in England and have felt for the last 40 years that closer and closer identification with the undemocratically elected EU just to keep BMW, Mercedes and VW cars affordable in America was not reason enough to allow them to dictate MY country's laws. Bribing the rich people of London worked for a long time but as so well put by a Yorkshire woman when asked why she didn't worry about the consequences of a Brexit she said: [B]"We have nout now, what more can they take away?". [/B]
modelt1826
A lot of the leave campaign was around immigration at the moment the UK Boarder control is based in Calias so when any clandetines are found the Boarder control return them to the French police. I can see the French asking us now to move back to Dover so when the Clandestines arrive you cannot return them anywhere and accept them as asylum seekers. This will please the French as it gets rid of the masses of people trying to reach UK in and around Calias. What will the leavers do with all the Europeans already set up home in the UK. I guess there could be a flood of European people to make sure they are in the land of plenty before Boarders are closed. Unless the leavers come up with a very good plan to trade with the EU the only thing leaving UK will be jobs. The three big car makers Honda Nissan And Toyota did not set up in UK just for the UK market they wanted access to the EU which now is in jeopardy (wherever that is).
Zimbo
An American who lives in Bali getting a vote ,that's very democratic I couldn't even vote in the independence referendum.I agree that this was payback by the working class for neglect but its was also about immigration. The country is now severely fractured and the next referendum may well be another Scottish independence referendum.P.S. there goes my sons European passport unless Scotland gets independence[/QUOTE]In view of the above, should I take Mr Markits postings with a pinch of salt?
Markit
In view of the above, should I take Mr Markits postings with a pinch of salt?[/QUOTE]Absolutely, but that has nothing to do with the mad - scotsman's grousing. You should take every post here as the best attempts of people who live here (me) as their best opinion on any matter they contribute on. Idiocy is generally kept in check be the other astute member - that live in Bali/Indonesia.
geedee
England exit Europe again that's the second time in less than a week.Iceland 2 -1 Englandhow sad
tel522
a very depressing period for uk passport holders like me , crashing pound ,chaos in Westminster, racists coming to the fore, iv got the noose ready! reasons to be cheerful hmm
geedee
Its definitely a divided countrybelow is a great rousing speech today from an SNP member at the EU parliament which gets standing ovation[url=http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-referendum-scottish-mep-alyn-smith-standing-ovation-in-european-parliament-speech-scotland-a7107106.html]Scottish MEP receives standing ovation in European Parliament after passionate speech saying Scotland 'voted to remain' | UK Politics | News | The Independent[/url]
Markit
In reality Scotland has a population of 5.2 million a little more than half of London. Rousing speeches are all wonderful but where were they 2 week ago?Fact is most of the UK didn't believe or understand what was coming at them and surprise, surprise the rest of the UK (outside of London) hasn't had much of the economic miracle that was supposed to be the EU membership, and voted accordingly.Even if all the parties are in chaos at the moment and playing catchup with their voters wishes it's the best thing for Europe and the UK that they are out now. Let the chips fall where they will, it will be painfilled for a while but when the pigs at the EU trough are thrown out finally it will be a much better and well run place to live IMHO.
ronb
To trigger such a massive change on a 52-48 vote now seems crazy. With hindsight the bar should not have been set at 50, but maybe 55 or 60. Or like in Australian referendums have something looking for uniformity of mood. I think in Australia referendums there has to be an overall majority AND ALSO a majority in a majority (4 out of 6) of states.
Markit
When majority rule is brought into question it's always by the losers.
davita
The UKP today gets under IDR 17,000 and US$ 1.29...really glad I liquidated my sterling account and got IDR 20,000 for each UKP a couple of months ago.I guess not many Brits coming on holiday to Bali....or anywhere else...soon.edit: Just seen that Agrea Leadsom has pulled out of the PM race...and she was a Brexit voter. One commentator said 'she hasn't got bottle' gotta love that expression which I've not heard for a very long time.Now leaves only Theresa May to lead the UK out of EU....and she was with Cameron and voted to stay.....Now I'm going over to the comedy channel....this news one is too dismal.
