JohnnyCool

Well-Known Member
Jan 10, 2009
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Sanur
I will try to be as level-headed as I can with this, although I'm seething with anger at the moment.
Read on.

My mother passed away in Australia last Sunday. I need to go there as soon as possible. I have a retirement Kitas and before leaving Indonesia, I have to get an "Exit Permit". My Indonesian wife will accompany me (she's been there before).

The death is stressful enough, and running around organising things for a fast departure hasn't been easy. I've managed to do everything except for the "Exit Permit".

I lodged it at the Immigration office in Denpasar yesterday. They told me it might be ready the same day, or "definitely" the next day. I'm still waiting. They told me a couple of hours ago that it will "definitely" be ready by three o'clock tomorrow afternoon. I "thanked" them for that but our flight is tomorrow night.

This sort of stuff pisses me of to the max. Do these people really have no compassion or understanding whatsoever?

In stark contrast, I got a multiple entry Australian Visitor's Visa for my wife in 15 minutes.

I still have several things to do here before I go. I am not impressed by having to sit around wasting many hours waiting for some Indonesian Immigration idiot to get their act together and phone me (which they rarely do, by the way).

Are Indonesian "officials" really that uncaring? It looks like it to me and I'm disgusted.

I might be pushing the envelope too far but the way I see it, they couldn't care less if an expat suddenly has a problem back in their country. Do many Indonesians really see us only as walking money bags?

I first visited Bali 37 years ago. I've been living here for about the last 16 years. These days in the South (where I live), every day is dance with potential death on the "roads".

I am seriously considering leaving Bali and never coming back. Kind of had enough of the endless crap these days.

Whatever "magic" Bali once had is being rapidly eroded, big time.

:icon_evil:
 

nattoman

New Member
Mar 9, 2010
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LIKE THIS..These days in the South (where I live), every day is dance with potential death on the "roads".

I am seriously considering leaving Bali and never coming back. Kind of had enough of the endless crap these days.

Whatever "magic" Bali once had is being rapidly eroded, big time.

I as well getting fed up w/ Bali and the quality life going down hill..Its way to hot all the time and to stressful doing biz.
Check ur replys twitter. I sent u info citric acid.I also live Renon. Been here 20yrs..Follow me twitter so I can send u direct messages instead of coming here.
cheers
Nattoman
 

hinakos

Member
Sep 3, 2008
517
1
16
Bali + Vietnam
I feel for the situation you are in JC....helpless. That is unless if you speed the system up the good (bad) ole way. Your morals may prevent you from doing this reading most of your posts.I too am having such feelings.Ive spent the last 5 months working for a company 41% owned by pertamina and 30% owned by the Suharto family. It was previously (up until 2008)* 100% owned by Pertamina. It was publicly listed then and the Suharto clan bought in.As such, its never done business using finance as a driver for sucess, only power and authority.ITs extremely nationalisitic, and despises having to use foreign expertise working in the public sector as it does now. As such, my usual work day consists of constantly being set up, having to take full responsibilty for things completely beyond my control, people accessing my personal details through HR dept and smsing my partner with all manner of horrible stories (blocking senders # of course), and a complete lack of co-operation even down to sabotage.Before anyone says...."well what are you doing there"?, well im not for much longer.Im walking away. Maybe even being fired before i get a chance (their always a month late with their pay so gotta be careful in the execution).* This short little trip into how big business in Indonesia is run has crushed a lot of the hope I had for Indo.I thought it was all being cleaned out!The corruption/beurocratic issues in Indonesia are not getting any better, not being adressed, and are actually on the rise with the push for national* economic and business recovery . Although it wont have enough effect to make me leave Indo (not immediately anyway), this little experience certainly has me checking my options.I'll certainly be trying to make sure my next contract is outside Indonesia. A month on at work here, and then "unwinding " here for a month has my gagging right now.Not meaning to publicly vent, but can somewhat sympathyze JC.
 

begonia

Member
Oct 10, 2007
313
5
18
This sort of stuff pisses me of to the max. Do these people really have no compassion or understanding whatsoever?

Not, they don´t, I realised many years ago that compassion is not something familiar for many people here...:icon_sad:

Are Indonesian "officials" really that uncaring? It looks like it to me and I'm disgusted.

Yap, they are that uncaring.......

I might be pushing the envelope too far but the way I see it, they couldn't care less if an expat suddenly has a problem back in their country. Do many Indonesians really see us only as walking money bags?

You are right they don´t care!! what I am not sure is if all these is just about money, I don´t think so, sometimes is just about their aptitude and way to see the things!!! hehehe thousands times since I live in Bali I though people has not feelings...............not the ones we use to have........


:icon_evil:


I am sorry to hear all this JC, and I am really hope by now you have already the exit permit!!!!!!!!!! must be a very stressfull day for you leaving tonight.
JC in a way I am surprise about all this, I mean your reaction, of course is normal, but what I mean is that after reading many of your post, I always though that you "know quite well" indonesian or balinese people and all the burocrasy system!!!!!!!! will never stop to surprise you isn´t it? and that can be really really tiring...........I agree with you is not an easy country to live...
I have to do my own exit permit before 2th April and the agency charge me 600.000 Rp, I still thinking if will be worthy or not to pay or do it myself..............
I hope all things went well for you today!!
 

JohnnyCool

Well-Known Member
Jan 10, 2009
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I always though that you "know quite well" indonesian or balinese people and all the burocrasy system
I am not surprised by lax Indonesian officials, under normal circumstances! I am usually prepared to wait when I have to. I don't regard an important family death as something I have any control of.

I finally got my Exit Permit at 3:15pm today, three days after I applied for it. Even so, I still had to protest a little about how long it was still taking. I think they got the message and they gave me discount of Rp50,000 (I paid Rp350,000).

By the time I walked back to my car where my wife was waiting for me, she'd just received a phone call from the Immigration official telling her that I seemed to be a bit agitated/angry and that she should try and calm me down.

Repeating myself, when the Australian Consulate learned of the reason why my wife needed a Visitor's Visa for Australia, it was issued on the spot within 15 minutes!

We fly to Australia tonight.

:icon_rolleyes:
 

MiSO

Member
Jul 29, 2009
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Sorry man to hear about this extra stress you definetely don't need.
Good it's all been settled now. Hang on there.
 

lumumba

Member
Sep 17, 2008
489
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Bandung-Bali-Jakarta
I’m sorry JC and condolences.
I can’t remember if you already have the retirement visa (KITAP) or not, if you don’t the only way to avoid this is to apply for a multiple entry/exit permit right at the beginning (not cheap) when you apply for the visa, but than again why someone should apply b4 hand. Why do we need a BLOODY entry/exit permit? Money of course but then again the system should at least work.


I am seriously considering leaving Bali and never coming back. Kind of had enough of the endless crap these days.
I
I do understand you 100% since I feel exactly the same way.


Do these people really have no compassion or understanding whatsoever?
Do many Indonesians really see us only as walking money bags?
Without any doubts, but maybe will change in future and be worse for them.
 

motormouth

Member
Aug 29, 2009
213
0
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Canggu
Sorry to here about your loss JC. My father died last November, for immediate trips out of Bali(which is @8 times per year) I got a multiple entry business visa...to avoid the crap that you went through. When I organized my trip back to Oz for Dads' funeral, that was the easy part, the biggest hassle was family members agreeing on the funeral arrangements. Hope all goes well
 

Markit

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2007
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Karangasem, Bali
JC sorry to hear about your loss but I have to remind you that any country where you have people paying for their jobs the same people must use the job to "earn" their livings.

The problem that all expats have everywhere is that over time they tend to forget why they so happily left their homelands.

If you haven't cooled down yet I suggest you take the opportunity while in Oz to just pop along to the housing department and ask what you have to do to get building permission for a house there or maybe register for a driving license. I've just picked these 2 examples at random for all I know they may not fit at all, but I'm sure you get my meaning.
 

JohnnyCool

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Jan 10, 2009
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Thank you all for the condolences, etc.

We made it to Australia OK and with our newly acquired Indonesian tax numbers, didn't have to pay fiskal.

Australia was sort of a breath of fresh air, mostly. Before I left Bali, I managed to renew my NSW driver's licence using the internet. (My licence had expired in September, 2008.) No problem so long as it's less than two years since expiry.

I own properties there so applying for building permission is not an issue for me. For sure, Australian bureaucracy can be pretty mean, at times. But at least you can easily find and get the information required, unlike here in Bali or the rest of Indonesia.

:icon_e_ugeek:
 

JohnnyCool

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Jan 10, 2009
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Are you staying Phil?
Yes, at least for a while longer.

How much longer is hard to say at this point. I just had a conversation with some reputably wealthy Balinese "construction managers". Things started to go down hill a bit when they started to ask me all the usual stuff.

"Where are you from? What business do you have? How long have you been in Bali? etc."

As soon as I said I wasn't at all interested in starting or running a "business" in Bal, I was sort of cross-examined. I explained to them my own experiences with businesses, both here and in Java. I also mentioned the fact that I see much of Bali these days as going down the drain in rapid time.

Lack of decent infrastructure, problems with water, electricity and pollution, not to mention over-crowding. Lack of realistic health resources. Poor education facilities. Too much corruption. Too much greed. Too much ignorance. Too much "pride" in a seriously challenged culture.

I really couldn't think of positive things to say about the island, in its present state.

I used to love this place with a passion. It grieves me to see it transforming into an horrendous, money-grubbing tourist-orientated nightmare. As someone once said...like a Hindu Disneyland.

I'll probably be here another year or two. Maybe.
Maybe not.

:icon_e_ugeek:
 

Jimbo

Active Member
Jan 11, 2005
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Ah but you have always been a bit of a pessimist :icon_biggrin: I must admit the Bali dream is losing its attraction a bit but seeing Markit building his place means it has not gone yet.

I am coming over in August/September to see for myself before making a final decision.
 

JohnnyCool

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Jan 10, 2009
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One dictionary definition of a "pessimist" is "a person who expects the worst".

If the "worst" means something like droves of incompetent, money-hungry "repair personnel", then I'm a pessimist. Why? Based upon many bad experiences, I look to an improvement in the future. For balance, I should point out that by no means have all of my experiences been negative.

I have an unconventional way of looking at optimists and pessimists.

"Optimists" tend to look at the past and hope things will improve in the future.

"Pessimists" tend to look at the future and hope that the mistakes of the past will not be repeated.

We all know about "Is the glass half full or half empty" conundrum?
What about if the glass is not big enough?

I must admit the Bali dream is losing its attraction a bit but seeing Markit building his place means it has not gone yet. I am coming over in August/September to see for myself before making a final decision.
How so? Who's dreaming the Bali Dream? And what is it, exactly?

Read Markit's recent posts about the electricity situation for his place. How much per electricity pole, etc?

There is no substitute for first-hand, on the ground experience, so to speak, especially if one is considering parting with substantial sums of money to build something or start/invest in a business.

There are a thousand (million?) smiles in Asia and you almost never know which ones are true.
Unless you're lucky, or a "chosen one".

:icon_e_ugeek:
 

Markit

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2007
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Phil I do understand and agree with your point of view and, Jeddi knows, the island isn't perfect by any stretch of the imagination ... but! Don't you think it's all about the individual movie we all have playing in our own heads? Pessimist or optimist who cares - we all just try and deal with each day as it comes and wring the most laughs and pleasure out of it we can.

I didn't come to Bali to die here - many people do. They also go to Florida, Spain and not least Switzerland. The deepest wish of many of these people is to be left in peace and quiet until the event happens. I understand that but until that time most of us need adventures, excitement, mountains to climb and asses to kick and if a little corrupt bureaucracy is all that's standing in the way then I say - get-it-the-fuck-on!

But if this has become you then you really, really need to find another goal in life buddy or a pleasant retirement home in Oz!

I'm really not trying to be nasty - this is my caring, feeling side - sorry if I offend.
 

JohnnyCool

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Jan 10, 2009
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Don't you think it's all about the individual movie we all have playing in our own heads? Pessimist or optimist who cares - we all just try and deal with each day as it comes and wring the most laughs and pleasure out of it we can.
Spot on, Markit. I agree completely.

...I understand that but until that time most of us need adventures, excitement, mountains to climb and asses to kick and if a little corrupt bureaucracy is all that's standing in the way then I say - get-it-the-fuck-on!
Bugger! I didn't know about that (he wrote, spilling even more beer over his keyboard).

But if this has become you then you really, really need to find another goal in life buddy or a pleasant retirement home in Oz!
I'm not sure what it is that I've possibly become. I never give up on anything and am not about to start now. I think, after 15+ years in Bali, I still have a sense of humour. I think I also have reasonable ideas (based upon bakso "reality sandwiches") about the ways in which Bali is steadily declining. I'm neither Balinese nor wish to be. If Balinese can't see what's happening around them (and don't care), that's their problem, not mine. I have options (many Balinese don't).

I've been putting up with an annoying rattle coming from somewhere underneath my car. I took it to the main Daihatsu service centre (in Sanur) today. Ninety minutes later, it was "fixed". I drove the car around the block and nothing had been fixed (or, something had been "fixed" that wasn't broken in the first place). Of course, I went back.

Three and a half hours later, it was really fixed. I had to wait around for a total of five hours for a simple rattle to be repaired. Sure as hell, I was super happy about that. (Well, at least it was fixed and only cost Rp 41,000, plus whatever my time was worth.)

I know this is a trivial example, but it's one of many bules have to contend with on a daily basis, for the privilege of living on The Island Of The Dogs...

The ingenuous expression on the service guy's face when he picked me up for a test drive, from the restaurant I'd toted up a large bill waiting for my car, was wonderful to behold (especially since the rattle was gone). I turned my car stereo on and cranked it up to 6 (didn't want to freak him out, too much). My car stereo goes to 11.

Anybody getting my drift here?

:icon_e_ugeek:
 

Jimbo

Active Member
Jan 11, 2005
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Its funny but I am not coming to die but the odds are I will. My grave is already prepared but that is because it is part of my wifes custom and no mateer where I die I know she will have me buried in here beloved Toraja. (me I would be happy being burnt).

Still I have never been happier than when I have been in Bali and if I can spend my time there I hope that will continue. As you say Phil it can get you down but what you have described for your car can be found anywhere as can the daily niggles you find just being there.

All I know is that if I do not try I will always regret it so to take the forums advice I intend to rent first, explore in detail and then make a decision.

As for you I think you will stay :icon_biggrin:
 

BKT

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Apr 2, 2010
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I know how you feel, I've only been here 3 years but the crap I've had to put up with in that short period of time would be enough to make most people go home, I'm not sure how long I'll be here, I'm still young so I'm not here to retire, maybe when my kids are old enough to go to school.
 

JohnnyCool

Well-Known Member
Jan 10, 2009
1,414
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Jimbo
All I know is that if I do not try I will always regret it so to take the forums advice I intend to rent first, explore in detail and then make a decision...As for you I think you will stay...
Definitely a wise thing to do. You might be surprised to see how much a lot of Bali has changed since you were last here. And I'll be here for at least another year - you're right.

BKT
I know how you feel, I've only been here 3 years but the crap I've had to put up with in that short period of time would be enough to make most people go home...
Not all of us are "most people". Unfortunately, "the crap" you refer to seems to be spreading, unabated. Despite that, I still manage to meet genuinely friendly and honest Balinese who are as appalled as some of the rest of us with what's happening to the island (and its culture).

:icon_cry:
 

tintin

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Sep 13, 2005
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The ingenuous expression on the service guy's face when he picked me up for a test drive, from the restaurant I'd toted up a large bill waiting for my car, was wonderful to behold (especially since the rattle was gone). I turned my car stereo on and cranked it up to 6 (didn't want to freak him out, too much). My car stereo goes to 11.

Anybody getting my drift here?

:icon_e_ugeek:

Do you mean that a volume of ONLY 6 was loud enough to cover the rattle? Then, it must have been a small rattle, indeed... So, why didn't you think of doing so in the first place? It would have saved you lots of time, aggravation, not to mention the large bill...:icon_rolleyes:

But maybe YOU wanted to convince the service guy that the rattle was indeed no longer audible? :icon_cry: