Things That Bother Me Most About Bali

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Roy

Active Member
Nov 5, 2002
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Ubud, Bali
I’ve had it in my mind to write a post about this for a while. So much of what is written on this, or any other forum on Bali accentuates the positive. To maintain balance, some “pet peeves” should be discussed from time to time. Join in and share yours. Here are a few of mine, offered in no particular order:

1) Rules of the road, or more appropriately, the lack thereof.

This is broad brushed and encompasses everything from failing to yield the right of way, failing to yield to emergency vehicles, in particular ambulances, to allowing kids to drive motorbikes. Kids driving motorbikes really drives me nuts...no pun intended.

I’ve noted over the years that once a Balinese takes the wheel of a car, or jumps on a motorbike, a metamorphosis occurs. When engaged in such activity, a complete disregard for their own safely, or the safety of others seems to overwhelm them. These otherwise kind, gentle, and polite people seem to be seized in some sort of Kamikaze trance, convinced that they are invincible to death or injury.

2) Ceremony, ceremony, ceremony.

As I am married into a Balinese family, this is more of a personal issue for me. In truth, it’s kind of a “love/hate” relationship and often enough a cause of personal frustration. It seems every time I turn around it is yet another full moon, another new moon, another Kliwon, another otonon, another Galungan, another Kuningan, another Nyepi, another 3 day ceremony at one of our six village temples, visits to the high priest for holy water.....endless, and forever endless.

While my wife and her family never press me to participate, nor do they attempt to impart the slightest guilt when I don’t....the fact is, it is that alone which makes me feel so guilty when I don’t! This must be some sort of Balinese voodoo magic or reverse psychology being played on me?

The truth be told, on all of the many occasions when I drop what I am doing...largely involved in supporting my family...clean myself up, get dressed and go, I am always happy that I participated. While adapting to Balinese life and culture, this has truly been my greatest challenge.

3) Total lack of urgency.

This is another source of great frustration for me personally. This topic encompasses everything from being timely with keeping appointments, to understanding the word, “now.” You would think in all these years of living on Bali I would have learned to never use the word “now” on a Balinese. If you say “now” to a Balinese, you have most certainly invited them to do whatever it is you requested to be expedient, on their time, and whenever they decide the time is right. The same goes for the word, “hurry.” Here, “hurry” means, “engage the slow motion mode.” Again, this is another cultural void that I have found difficult to manage with a smile.

OK, there are three of mine. I’ve tried to present them in a semi-humorous manner, as let’s face it, these little things, when viewed within the big picture of life on Bali, don’t add up to squat. But! They can be fun to talk about.
 

charlie

Member
Aug 9, 2005
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unhappily in sydney
3) Total lack of urgency.

This is another source of great frustration for me personally. This topic encompasses everything from being timely with keeping appointments, to understanding the word, “now.” You would think in all these years of living on Bali I would have learned to never use the word “now” on a Balinese. If you say “now” to a Balinese, you have most certainly invited them to do whatever it is you requested to be expedient, on their time, and whenever they decide the time is right. The same goes for the word, “hurry.” Here, “hurry” means, “engage the slow motion mode.” Again, this is another cultural void that I have found difficult to manage with a smile.

take that and then put it into the western world :shock: !!!!! I have come so close to being a murderer !!! Tu just drives me up the wall !!! he forgets that things run differently here ...
 

Adam

Member
Jul 21, 2006
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Western Australia
Mine would have to be litter, in particular plastic, though things are improving I suppose, It's amazing how many Balinese must think plastic is biodegrable or something. Funny but you never see to many glass bottles lying around.....

I'll never forget one day with Wayan at my hotel, her solution to my overfull ash tray was to tip it into the meticulously kept garden outside my door, when the bin was a good 10 feet closer!

I realise refuse services must be limited, but surely it can be confined to a small area. Just my own personal grizzle, Bali's too beautiful to be filling up with those awful black and white striped plastic bags and water bottles.

Adam
 

charlie

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Aug 9, 2005
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unhappily in sydney
Actually, this one really upsets me ....

Kids on motorikes with no helmets!!!! :evil:

And the expats in seminyak who fang around on tigers with no helmets on and their kids don't have one either :shock: !!!

If you wanna squash your own skull - go ahead, but atleast give your kids a chance ....
 

DCC

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May 27, 2006
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Br Abangan, Tegallelang
Plastic, plastic, plastic - the trash piled up everywhere in the south is a major bummer and to see it in the rivers makes me want to cry, the great bulk of this produced by local individuals. It's such a slap in the face to Ma nature. This requires some organized collection and much education - this is where I think a world community effort may be in order.

As far as traffic (good thread by the way Roy), it use to scare the bejesus out of me so now I never leave home, ooops gotta go pizza guy's at the door :).
 

irma1812

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Jan 27, 2004
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Re: RE: Things That Bother Me Most About Bali

charlie said:
Actually, this one really upsets me ....

Kids on motorikes with no helmets!!!! :evil:

And the expats in seminyak who fang around on tigers with no helmets on and their kids don't have one either :shock: !!!

If you wanna squash your own skull - go ahead, but atleast give your kids a chance ....

Charlie, this really does upset both my husband and I too!! It's a disgrace and they should be banned from riding motorbikes! :evil:
 

mosaic

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Oct 5, 2003
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1. garbage. The balinese should be somewhat ashamed of there lack of concern for the environment . Ther emust be a way to educate people not to throw their garbage in the river, beach , road etc. A real shame and turnoff for tourists who seem yo be important economic factor..
2. Dogs. many of these street doga are infected, injured, in obvious pain. Death would be a treat ...
3. The way many balinese men treat their wives, girlfreinds. I have scene so amny examples of this sadness...
 

DCC

Member
May 27, 2006
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Br Abangan, Tegallelang
Ok, ok, I know we're being tested here folks so why not show our true selves so after much thought I've decided to add . . .

Things That Bother Me Most About Bali:
1 The People
2 The Culture
3 The Weather
4 The Cost of Living
5 The Coastal and Rural Scenery

They bothered me so much that I sold everything I had, left my family and friends behind,and flew halfway round the world just to wallow in the feelings of misery they bring to me.
 

Tony

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Aug 24, 2005
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Maui, Hawaii
OK...here's my 2 cents worth...

1) The whole "must save face" thing...while not specifically limited to Bali, as a westerner used to direct & frank communication, I find the whole inability to say no quite maddening at times. As Made Wijaya once told me, "the Balinese have don't have a word for "NO"...but of course they do, it's YES".

2) The Seminyak expat thing of sitting around taking turns bragging about the number of household staff members you employ then alternately complaining about how lazy they are.
 

Roy

Active Member
Nov 5, 2002
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Ubud, Bali
Some interesting responses so far! DCC, your last post is very funny, and “spot on.” Anyway, a few more comments from my perspective:

1) Garbage. Depending on where one is in Bali, this is either a big problem, no problem, or a problem in some phase of resolution. In Gianyar Regency, and thanks to the endless efforts of Ubud Rotary, there is a new waste disposal plant, and anyone visiting Ubud recently, having been to Ubud say 10 years ago, will see a remarkable improvement in waste management. Mosaic, you wrote, “the Balinese should be somewhat ashamed of their lack of concern for the environment.”

That’s a bit rough in my view. Consider that plastic, which is a serious environmental issue, was introduced by the West and until modern times, was not a product in any form to be found here. Consider also how even today, the Balinese use 100% bio-degradable materials in their everyday life. Meals are still served on palm leaves, some dishes are wrapped within them as part of the cooking preparation, and produce, meat and fish is not pre-packaged, (plastic wrapped in Styrofoam), but rather bought fresh on the market. If anything, I personally regard the Balinese as either indigenously or instinctively being very aware of their environment. The fact that Aqua is only sold in plastic is not something the Balinese are responsible for, so I see no need for their shame.

2) Not to “pick on you” Mosaic, but you also wrote, “the way many Balinese men treat their wives, girlfriends. I have scene so many examples of this sadness...” I guess this observation would vary considerably among those of us who live here. I can only comment on the very personal knowledge of how the men in my wife’s family treat their wives...and it is remarkably sensitive and respectful. What goes on behind closed doors is something I am not privy to, but I see no evidence, nor have ever witnessed any sadness, scars, be they emotional or physical among any of the women in my family and greater population of my village.

3) The dogs! Oh yes, I agree with you there 100%. I would also add wild or ferule cats to that. My observations there conclude with this being a vicious cycle largely fueled by the Balinese attitude towards what in the West we regard as “household pets.” With only few exceptions, I have noted that the majority of Balinese regards their dogs, and cats, if they are around, as merely other animals in the environment of Bali. It is rare in Bali to find a Balinese who embraces such an animal in the loving and caring manner that we Westerners are accustomed.

In most villages I know, dogs are viewed as effective “first warning” of a possible intruder, and cats as effective eradicators of rats and mice. The next time I see a Balinese sitting down and holding his pooch on his lap, gently scratching him behind the ears will be my first time.

I have finally won my seven year battle with my wife, and soon we will be taking on a Yellow Lab as our household pet. I am fully aware that the educational process with my wife, our kids, and her family regarding that pup will take a great deal of my time. On this point, I agree with you 100% and can only hope over time that things change.

The issue of kids either driving or riding on motorbikes seems to be the majority “pet peeve.” As for them riding on motorbikes, some of this is based on economic reality, but as someone pointed out...PLEASE at least with helmets! As for them driving motorbikes, I personally think it should be a crime.

Once again Mosaic, I did not mean to pick on you personally. Each of us has have formulated our own pet peeves based on personal experience, each of which is unique.

Tony! I just caught your post before I posted again. YES...on both accounts! As for your second point, believe it or not, I even know one guy down there who makes his household staff wear uniforms AND photo ID’s!!!! I kid you not. It blew me away and Eri cried about it on the way home to Ubud. Pembantus are NOT indentured servants, and they should be treated with utmost respect and dignity. Good points Tony!

As for your first point, I also agree, this is not just limited to Bali. It seems more an overall Asian thing. I call it the "it's up to you" syndrome.
 

charlie

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Aug 9, 2005
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unhappily in sydney
“the way many Balinese men treat their wives, girlfriends. I have scene so many examples of this sadness...” I guess this observation would vary considerably among those of us who live here. I can only comment on the very personal knowledge of how the men in my wife’s family treat their wives...and it is remarkably sensitive and respectful. What goes on behind closed doors is something I am not privy to, but I see no evidence, nor have ever witnessed any sadness, scars, be they emotional or physical among any of the women in my family and greater population of my village.

Mosaic, you must have had a very different experience... I have only ever experienced the same as Oom Roy and as a woman with a balinese boyfriend and then husband i have only ever encountered respect and tenderness.


The issue of kids either driving or riding on motorbikes seems to be the majority “pet peeve.” As for them riding on motorbikes, some of this is based on economic reality, but as someone pointed out...PLEASE at least with helmets!

... it was the no helmets. The kids on bikes (local and expat) with their parents and no helmets - it is the parents responsibility...

As for them driving motorbikes, I personally think it should be a crime.

I'm with you there Oom Roy ... I'm sure everyone has seen a bad accident but i witnessed 2 young lads (about 14yrs) ride straight into the back of a parked truck at night and die instantly ... i have had a different view on helmets and young kids on bikes eversince...
 

charlie

Member
Aug 9, 2005
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unhappily in sydney
The next time I see a Balinese sitting down and holding his pooch on his lap, gently scratching him behind the ears will be my first time.

You'll have to come and visit Oom Roy !!! We have two lovely dogs called Billy and Chris and Tu brought them, feeds them, and calls them his own....

And then I can take you to Tanah Lot and you can use a pay toilet - 2 firsts in one day!!! heheheheheheheheh :lol: :lol: :lol:
 

ChadM

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Jun 13, 2006
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i witnessed 2 young lads (about 14yrs) ride straight into the back of a parked truck at night and die instantly
Gadzooks. I would have been traumatized for days on end, Charlie, especially given my love for kids. I saw an accident on Ngurah Rai Bypass my first time to Bali, years ago, between a van and a motorbike. The man on the bike was wearing one of those laughably woebegone plastic batting-style helmets that's about as useful as wearing an Easter bonnet. Anyway, he was laid out in the middle of the road, and Balinese seemed to come out of the woodwork, running to his aid, dragging him and his ruin of a motorbike out of the roadway. It was pretty disturbing imagery. I can't imagine it had it involved kids and death.

One of my profound dislikes about Bali, and there are admittedly very few, is the proliferation of cockfighting. I understand its roots, and that the bloodletting is necessary for some of the Balinese rituals, but let's face it: Much more often than not, it's just something to gamble on, and these animals, who live a fairly miserable life to begin with, pay for these men's few seconds of entertainment with their lives. I'm not a reactionary, nor am I a radical animal-rights person, but I find the whole specter of cockfighting to be quite appalling.

The littering is another annoyance. I remember back in the 70s, there was a massive campaign in the United States to try and effect a change in people's thinking about littering. Anyone alive in this country at that time surely remembers the crying Native American commercial. That, and the threat of stiff fines, seemed to really work over a period of time. Perhaps Bali needs a similar ad campaign, but I'll not be holding my breath. It's the casual disregard for discarding personal trash properly I'm referring to here, not the larger issue of waste disposal. The pragmatic side of me, which is dominant, does understand that Bali is a small island bursting at the seams with people, and as such, littering and waste disposal will likely continue to be a challenge.

I agree about the pestilential dogs everywhere you turn. I'm definitely a dog lover, so I find it rather heartbreaking to see the poor beasts in this feral, unloved-by-humans state. It's a shame they can't sterilize these dogs with blow darts. I witnessed more middle-of-the-road canine sex on my last trip to Bali than I've seen cumulatively in my entire life.

Another thing that's recently cropped up (as of my trip a few weeks ago): Touts on the beach at Jimbaran Bay's seafood restaurants. I was mortified. They wouldn't leave us alone, often the same vendor coming by our table repeatedly, peddling their necklaces and other riff-raff, or standing right in the middle of our view of the ocean. I go there to eat a nice, fresh seafood dinner and enjoy a great sunset, not be pestered throughout my dinner by touts. I said as much to the management of the restaurant (which I had been to numerous times on previous trips). Until they run these scalawags off, I'll not return. Shameful. :(

Great idea for a thread, Roy (is Oom similar to Pak?)... it's so easy to wax poetic about how spectacular and magical Bali is (and rightly so), overlooking or glossing over its less-than-desirable qualities, but as I read in a book about Bali, "paradise doesn't mean perfection." It's more a state of mind. To me, that sums it up succinctly. Bali isn't perfect, but it's certainly paradise as far as I'm concerned.
 

jogry blok

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Sep 28, 2005
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Dencarick
We are newbies to bali (2 years).
I agree with the comments about the poor balinese dogs. We have 2 dogs, 1 balinese and the other a mix between dobberman and weimaran we have the male as well as the female spayed. We also have 2 cats, spayed.
My comments on staff: I was ask if I would provide them with uniform. (trousers and Tshirts) they like to wear them gives them a feeling of belonging. We have done what the indonesian government ask for employed 4. 1 driver/gardener , 1 gardener, 1 houskeeper, 1 helper for her.
We really have too many staff, but at least we provided work and wages. They are with us 2 years and very happy, so are we. They are always right on time.(no caret time here).
My home is cleaner than when I cleaned mine in Aussie.
Never has anything gone missing. We are all a happy team together. Laugh and make jokes! They have never thrown a sicki like they do in NZ and australia.
I am living next to a kali and see all the things go by into the sea. This has been going on nearly 50 years, They should start teaching the young at school. I think that way they might break the habit. A little time ago I wrote about the sensless killing of small birds with a gun.even going up the tree to empty the nests.
We are very happy in Bali, I have not seen any grafity, neither serious crime. I feel much safer living in Bali than in Australia or New Zealand
 

Ringo

Member
Rules of the Road - No Rules.

As a westerner you need to have an immortality pact with God when biking the roads of Bali kangin-kauh.

If you are Balinese then an offering with Tumpek Landep should do the immortality job for you, as the Balinese erroneously believe that making offerings for motorbikes (and cars), because they are made out of metals (with reference to the Keris as the symbol of Tumpek Landep), automatically gives them the right of immortality :-0

Tumpek Landep, which means 'close to sharp' - just like the sharp top of the keris - however is symbolic for 'pikiran suci, hati murni' - positive thinking, control of negative emotions, right speaking and right conduct. Also on the roads of Bali. The extremely high number of accidents, just like the percentage of marks on the Family tempels (feb. 2005), should be a clear sign to change direction. Hmm.

Then the extremely high number of (often expensive) ceremonies.

Me too I'm married into a Hindu Balinese Family, God bless them. So I am a Hindu too, had my Mawinten Ceremony back in 2003, and I consider myself a 'Kuturan Hindu', with reference to the Javanese Hindu priest Kuturan who was in Bali early 11th Century. He taught the people to pray with flowers, incense and holi water, with the accent on 'pikiran suci, hati murni', the main temples being located in the head and in the heart. I like him, this Kuturan. He is an ultra-conservative compared to the Business Priest of nowadays, isn't he?

People pray for success in business and health, spend enormous amounts of money to reach this, and still comlain every day, "Adoh, pusing, dimana mencari uang, bankrup" and the practices of doctors and balians are penuh with sick and ill people every day. What to do? Spend more money? Or return to the Lore of Kuturan? Up to them.

A total lack of urgency and the interpretation of the term "now"

The time is always now, don't forget that dear Roy! :)
What is urgent for you (me, us) isn't urgent for 'them', unless we would share the common interest 'find money' :))

I would add observations such as a lack of initiative and motivation, an absence of personal responsibility, an in general under-developed ability of analytical thinking, and the inablility to draw a line between reality an fiction, which makes bilateral western-balinese communication somewhat more complicated.

Being able to sense thoughts and emotions (ilmu ketahuan Saraswati!) helps a lot when dealing with the Balinese, as a westerner.

Plastic and other Garbage

Ibu Pertiwi by the mouth of Dewa Mahadewa is sick of it, she's throwing up and trembling, wanting to get rid of it all. Dewa Baruna and Dewi Manik Mas Segara (or Lörö Kidul if you like or if you are Javanese) lend the helping hand of Vishnu with seculiar cleansing in the form of tsunamis.

Money obsession

Pasar Agung melanting, near Pulaki, is the main tempel of the traders, and the symbol of the economy of Bali. This tempel has two times been destroyed recently, once in 2000 by fire and once in 2002 by water. Or, both Brahma and Vishnu were responsible for the destruction of this symbol of Bali's economy.

In 2003 a monkey left his colony at the Pulaki temple and travelled 77 k along the coast from seaside temple to seaside temple to Pura Ponjok Batu, both temples which are connected to Nirartha, another Javanese Hindu priest who was in Bali late 15th century. Nirartha is the Guru of the Brahman priests and taught how the people had to meditate, pray, and live their lives.

During the Full Moon night of July 2003, Dewa Patih Agung of the Pulaki temple transmitted a message via one of the priests of the Pulaki temple, which was witnessed by my humble person, explaining about the travelling monkey.

"People should not be like (the) monkeys, they should respect themselves, respect each other, respect nature, respect God. They should start living their lives (again) as it is supposed to be. As long as this doesn't happen, Bali (the world) will not be safe".

Six more years, and we have reached the year 2012, a milestone year for humanity. Research on the Internet surfaces what has happend 12,500 years ago, symptoms of which are re-occurring at this moment, in our lifetime.

Who agrees with Louis XIV, "Après moi le déluge"? And who disagrees?

Warm (and dry) regards,
Ringo

;-)
 

Bert Vierstra

Active Member
Nov 5, 2002
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the helping hand of Vishnu with seculiar cleansing in the form of tsunamis.

Maybe Vishnus cleansing needs some refinement, besides the garbage, some people were "cleansed" as well.

Hmmm, laser guided tsunami's....
 

Roy

Active Member
Nov 5, 2002
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Ubud, Bali
Ringo! Where the heck have you been??? It's been ages since we last heard from you. How about an update on your latest acitivities when you have a chance.
 

FreoGirl

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Dec 21, 2004
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Fremantle, Australia
Plastic and rubbish are my biggest gripe. Every little thing you buy they want to put in a plastic bag. Indonesians are so used to chucking the rubbish on the ground (to be swept up and burned later) that they do it everywhere. I was always asking visitors not to throw food scraps etc on the ground in our yard when they were eating.

It all seems to be an Indonesian thing to me, rather than specific to Bali. Road rules (or lack there-of), helmets, rubbish, plastic, 'face', rubber time, arrogant ex-pats - we got it all in Lombok too. The ceremonies are maybe not as frequent - although everthing stops on Fridays for Jumat-an, and if there is a religious ceremony, everyone just knocks off and goes. Business comes second. The opposite to the Western culture - not that I am griping about that - I think that's great. And as everyone would agree, it's all part of the experience and charm.
Freo
(back in Freo these days :cry: )
 

Ringo

Member
Bert,

"Maybe Vishnus cleansing needs some refinement, besides the garbage, some people were "cleansed" as well"

No, wrong. People's perception and interpretation of their surroundings needs refinement. E.g. animals can 'forsee' natural disasters and as a result they are able to get themselves in safety in time. And we, the creme-de-la-creme of the creation, have the same abilities IF subjects like ESP are taken seriously. If not, well.....
I
n Bali they refer to ESP as 'Ilmu Ketahuan Saraswati'. knowledge that is based on the Laws of Energy, and the fact that everything that is, is interconnected by energy. Energy = Information = Knowledge.

"Oh, what can we expect in 2012"?

Nobody knows for sure. Changes, that's for sure. Depends on the energy balance of mass consciousness.


Roy,

"Ringo! Where the heck have you been???"

Lovina, and criss-crossing Bali on my Honda Terbang. Six days ago I 'did' Lovina-Denpasar-Lovina in 4 hours and 25 minutes. The policemen already know me I think, every now and then I can see them waving their hands when I speed past.

"It's been ages since we last heard from you."

Eons!

"How about an update on your latest acitivities when you have a chance.
"
Latest activities: lending a helping hand with the organization of "The Royal Palace Singaraja Bali Festival 2006", which will take place on August 12-14, this month. Right now I am square eyed.

Do you still frequent Naughty Nuri? Sushi and Martini's? ;-)

Ringo