Karragirl

New Member
Sep 17, 2016
3
0
1
Can/ Do a person with a diagnosis of Schizophrenia,
reside in Bali?
How would they be treated if they
suffered a psychotic episode or became
unstable.
Would they be welcome at clinic/
hospital for treatment?
or would they be locked up
somewhere horrible.
Would they be allowed to fly
Back to Australia with carer?
Thankyou
 

Steve Rossell

Member
Apr 18, 2015
300
6
18
Karragirl, I don't have any first hand knowledge to help you but if you are talking about an Australian citizen and this matter is urgent then I would strongly recommend calling the Australian Consul in Denpasar and asking for advice. Today.

Good luck.
 

sakumabali

Well-Known Member
Apr 2, 2010
1,056
185
63
Couple of months ago people tried to call the french embassy but it was already too late. the police shot the guy already (after he stabbed a policeman).
Happened in Canggu. He was schizo and on steroids. Sad
 

Karragirl

New Member
Sep 17, 2016
3
0
1
Karragirl, I don't have any first hand knowledge to help you but if you are talking about an Australian citizen and this matter is urgent then I would strongly recommend calling the Australian Consul in Denpasar and asking for advice. Today.

Good luck.
 

Karragirl

New Member
Sep 17, 2016
3
0
1
THANKYOU for replies.
It was really an inquiry for a friend of mine who is father & primary carer for his son.
They holiday each year in Bali, both seem to thrive whilst there.
Now, they are talking about the realities & practicalities of staying in Bali for longer periods.
Both Australian citizens/ Dad is on Carer's Pension, son on disability pension.
The son's health has been stable for a few years now, but I am thinking what would happen if son's health goes pear shape whilst living in Bali?
cheers & THANKYOU for any advice and/or replies.
 

spicyayam

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2009
3,592
342
83
Another thing to consider is whether you will still be able to get the disability pension in Bali. I believe the government clamped down on that some time ago.
 

SamD

Active Member
Sep 7, 2006
612
187
43
Seminyak
Caged people: the tragedy of Bali's mentally ill

From The Australian, Feb 14 2015

Full article here: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...l/news-story/17982a897b5f09c7e0a4a6f6cf02663f

IT’S a typical Bali setting. The TV burbles in the background. Sticks of incense smoulder in the morning sun and chatter fills the courtyard, competing with the incessant yapping of a caged dog as the family anticipates a Hindu cleansing ceremony.

Only the forlorn figure of Kadek, chained to his bed, his feet in stocks, in a room just metres from the courtyard hub, shatters the illusion. The 47-year-old’s sporadic guffaws punctuate the household’s routine. He sits facing a paneless window with a permanent view of half a tree and the dog.

His body is misshapen, gnome-like, and his skinny legs are bare, his only clothing a filthy, torn shirt. Empty banana leaves, which serve as a plate, lie on the bed beside a jar filled with coconut water. A bucket under the bed is his toilet and a crude hole has been cut in the *bamboo bed, dispensing with the need to move him. His family has disposed of his *faeces but the stench of caked filth and urine is overpowering.

Looking in, the viewer sees a grey, withered shadow of a man. His left eye is permanently closed and he has lost the ability to walk. Sometimes he makes eye contact; mostly he is lost in a desolate world. This morning, his 90-year-old mother has entered the fetid room, Kadek’s home for the past six years. Arm outstretched, he silently seeks a reassuring touch but she stays out of reach and ignores his entreaties. *Standing, locked in his gaze, she is inscrutable. Is it shame, remorse, guilt, anger, or simply love for a long-lost son that she feels? In a split second, Kadek segues from hope to despair. He withdraws his arm as if stung. His face shuts down. His mother retires to her adjoining room. No words have passed between them.

Kadek has schizophrenia and a tendency to aggression. His cousin-in-law, Anggraeni, 28, says Kadek’s propensity to attack people and steal would be unmanageable were he free. She is one of 10 family members, including three children, Kadek’s brother and elderly mother, sharing the compound in south-east Bali’s Klungkung regency. “This is horrible and sad, the chains, but Kadek is with mental illness,” Anggraeni says, adding the stocks are backup security should he break the chains. “If he was free he would make *trouble for the neighbours. Before [he was restrained] the family was scared of him. He was always disturbed. If people didn’t give him money or food he attacked them.”

Apart from a brief taste of freedom during a 2012 hospital stay for tuberculosis, Kadek has remained shackled. Does he complain of discomfort or pain? “He never says he is in pain,” Anggraeni replies. “Normally, people with *mental illness have strong antibodies. He never has colds or flu. When mosquitoes bite, he doesn’t complain; when the weather is cold, he doesn’t ask for a blanket.” Neither does Kadek wish for freedom. “No,” he replies emphatically when I inquire. It’s one of the few words he utters. There is nothing to suggest any semblance of a life amid the deprivation. And Kadek’s case is not uncommon — about 60,000 Indonesians live like this.

The practice of restraining the mentally ill is called pasung. Even though it has been outlawed since 1977, it is widespread among poor *Indonesian families who resort to iron shackles, wooden stocks, ropes, cages and locked rooms. The custom extends to many Asian and African countries but it has aroused little human rights concern and is neglected by researchers.

There has been some progress in Indonesia: since an anti-pasung program was launched in 2011, more than 5000 restrained people have been freed. The Health Ministry’s director of mental health, Eka Viora, says the rest should be released immediately. Viora is optimistic that a pasung-free program for 2015-19 will end shackling, although it’s unclear how violators would be penalised. There remain many obstacles to wiping out the practice, not least the severe shortage of mental health facilities. Mental health was allocated only about two per cent of the national budget last year, in a country where seven of the 34 provinces are without a dedicated hospital or programs and only 700 psychiatrists serve the sprawling archipelago of 240 million people. In Bali there is only one state psychiatric institution, the Bangli Mental Hospital. Last year, 45 previously shackled people were admitted there, on top of 32 in 2013, sparking hopes that more *families are seeking help (although two-thirds were returning patients.)

“The government knows there are many more out there not being treated,” says psychiatrist and head of services at Bangli, Dewa Gede Basudewa. “There is a lot of stigma with pasung patients. Most are schizophrenic with hallucinations. Families isolate them because they are ashamed and embarrassed. The patients have many long-term problems. Some cannot walk or have atrophy. Some have been in chains for 20 years. They have infections, tuberculosis, malnutrition. We want to find pasung people, prevent them from being rechained and stop them being chained in the first place. Families know it’s not good to chain them but they do because they are very poor.”
 

Markit

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2007
9,317
1,110
113
Karangasem, Bali
I would think that the patient's condition would improve immensely from being in a place like Bali but my main concern would be in securing a guaranteed supply of the drugs these people need on a regular basis. The description above of the sufferer is true but what it didn't mention was that there are very few psychotropic drugs available here and those that are can mostly only be found in Bangli where the mental hospital/prison is.

Perhaps he won't need them here?!
 

JohnnyCool

Well-Known Member
Jan 10, 2009
1,414
88
48
Sanur
..They holiday each year in Bali, both seem to thrive whilst there. Now, they are talking about the realities & practicalities of staying in Bali for longer periods..
If they are both on Australian pensions, how would they be able to afford staying here for "longer periods"? Obtaining visas for longer stays is not exactly a walk in the park, nor cheap.
I wonder what they would write on their application forms when asked about prior or existing medical conditions. Add to that travel insurance, ongoing accommodation costs and various other living expenses and I can't see how they would survive in the long term. Even the question of would they still get their pensions (or for how long) doesn't have a clear and exact answer.

I am a retired fully-qualified psychologist and an expat here for 20+ years. In my view, given the generally sub-standard quality of medical services in Bali, Bali is not the best place to get sick.
Of course, some hospitals are better than others, including private ones (such as BIMC, Siloam, etc). However, the private ones are still very expensive by local standards.
How someone suffering from a psychotic episode would be treated here is difficult to answer (especially if the person is a foreigner).

Nationwide, Indonesia currently has approximately one psychiatrist per 350,000 people. IMHO, many medical staff, (not all), are under-trained and/or not up-to-date.

For all the above reasons, my conclusion would be that for this father and son to contemplate "living" here is at least fraught with many difficulties, and at most foolish.
Many Balinese people are frightened by mental illness and thousands can't cope with it when it occurs in their own families.
The overall "help" for them is generally non-existent, because of the lack of available/affordable facilities, governmental interest in them, and poverty/little or no education, etc.
 

ronb

Well-Known Member
Aug 14, 2007
2,241
56
48
Ubud, Bali
I think the horror story of the schizophrenic chained to a bed is not relevant to Karragirl's post.That guy had been probably committed to that place by his family. And I expect Karragirl is probably aware of how they stand with Centrelink regarding pensions and so know how much time they could expect to spend in Bali.

So the question was more about what help they could get here and this probably boils down to availability of medications. The main hospitals here do not list mental illness as an area they deal with. The Dr Denny Thong I referred to above is on the Board of BIMC but BIMC does not claim to treat mental illness. However, I think you could find Dr Thong in his rooms in Canggu. I think the medications are available. I have Googled for generic olanzapine to get some idea. I think it would be available at around 15,000 per day (like a pack of cigs). I suspect some apoteks do not stock it, but I think you could order in from Jakarta, and I expect also that there are some Bali outlets - you just have to find them.
 

Markit

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2007
9,317
1,110
113
Karangasem, Bali
Several years ago we were unable to get Citalopram, a fairly common drug against depression in the west, anywhere but Bangli as I also said above - things may have changed.