Lost IMB certficate

[DenpasarHouse]

IMB = ijin mendirikan bangun-bangunan = wake-building permits (as per Google Translate)

Yeah, I don't think you're making this any less confusing by relying on Google translate. IMB = Izin (not ijin) Mendirikan Bangunan (buildings, not to wake up)

https://id.wikipedia.org/wiki/Izin_Mendirikan_Bangunan

In my opinion, it's confusing because there's a missing piece of the puzzle. When we talk about "land use" we're really talking about how the land is zoned. I don't know where you get the zoning information for your land, I've looked on my land certificate and can't see anything. Anyone know?

I'm pretty sure the IMB only pertains to the details of a building(s) and it's purpose. Whether you can get a IMB for a building(s) would depend on how the land was zoned.

 

[paulseawind]

Yeah, I don't think you're making this any less confusing by relying on Google translate. IMB = Izin (not ijin) Mendirikan Bangunan (buildings, not to wake up)

https://id.wikipedia.org/wiki/Izin_Mendirikan_Bangunan

In my opinion, it's confusing because there's a missing piece of the puzzle. When we talk about "land use" we're really talking about how the land is zoned. I don't know where you get the zoning information for your land, I've looked on my land certificate and can't see anything. Anyone know?

I'm pretty sure the IMB only pertains to the details of a building(s) and it's purpose. Whether you can get a IMB for a building(s) would depend on how the land was zoned.

Looks like a J to me, DPH ?

What does yours look like?

 

[DenpasarHouse]

This website implies that there is another separate certificate/permit simply for stating the zoning of the land:

BUILDING PERMIT IMB | ODISEA BALI, Integrated Building Services - Contractor BALI, LOMBOK, JAKARTA, MEDAN, NIAS

They describe it as " - Correct Land Use Permit (Zoning) for the building that is planned".

 

[DenpasarHouse]

View attachment 2643

Looks like a J to me, DPH ?

What does yours look like?

I haven't got one yet. I'll have to chase it up with the developer. But here's an example of one I found on the internet.



Yours looks like something I'd get from the head of the area or Kepala Lingkungan. It's probably a good example of the lack of attention to detail that plagues everything here in Indonesia. I'm not saying yours isn't valid, but bloody hell, they didn't even use the correct terminology. Maybe it's the old name for the IMB, or maybe it's just their best guess. It's understandable as 'ijin' means 'permission' whereas 'izin' means 'a permit', although this might be debatable.

 

[paulseawind]

This website implies that there is another separate certificate/permit simply for stating the zoning of the land:
BUILDING PERMIT IMB | ODISEA BALI, Integrated Building Services - Contractor BALI, LOMBOK, JAKARTA, MEDAN, NIAS
They describe it as " - Correct Land Use Permit (Zoning) for the building that is planned".

I think this is being drilled into far too deeply.
The IMB is for the use of the land. Full stop. New paragraph. It is not for the building alone and how many bedrooms, etc. It says you may build a house here and that house is x metres from the west fence and x metres from the east fence and x metres from the beach fence, and so on. And you can use the house (untuk) for this purpose.

E.G. There are 4 Villas here all along the beach. Mine is Tempat Tinggal. The next one is (now) Pondok Wisata because she rents it out. Very similar buildings. Same land size. We share a common boundary fence.

I.E. nothing to do with zoning. IMO, zoning sits above the IMB in the pecking order. Once the zoning has been set (from original rice field to housing by the developer) then it's the IMBs that rule.

You can complexicate this if you want but the IMB is the final word in what you can do with that land. It makes crystal clear sense to me.

Perhaps things changed since 2004 when my IMB was created? What year IMB are you looking at, DPH? That might be it.

And your quoted company - Odisea - perhaps they are referring to an IMB for Jakarta which might well be different to a more regional setting such as Bali (which seems to have it's own versions of some laws anyway, simply because it is Bali - the jewel in the Crown so to speak). That wouldn't surprise me at all.

 

[DenpasarHouse]

The IMB is for the use of the land. Full stop. New paragraph. It is not for the building alone and how many bedrooms, etc. It says you may build a house here and that house is x metres from the west fence and x metres from the east fence and x metres from the beach fence, and so on. And you can use the house (untuk) for this purpose.

Well I don't understand why you're so confident to proclaim this. Your sentence seems to confirm that the IMB only pertains to the building.

IMO, zoning sits above the IMB in the pecking order.

Yes, I agree, so why do you keep claiming the IMB pertains to the use of the land? If your land is zoned 'agricultural' you'll never get an IMB to build on it.

 

[paulseawind]

I haven't got one yet. I'll have to chase it up with the developer. But here's an example of one I found on the internet.

View attachment 2644

Yours looks like something I'd get from the head of the area or Kepala Lingkungan. It's probably a good example of the lack of attention to detail that plagues everything here in Indonesia. I'm not saying yours isn't valid, but bloody hell, they didn't even use the correct terminology. Maybe it's the old name for the IMB, or maybe it's just their best guess. It's understandable as 'ijin' means 'permission' whereas 'izin' means 'a permit', although this might be debatable.

DPH, sashay back a tad, mate. In case you don't remember, I did say I have been to the Dinas Pendapatan in Singaraja to have my Land Tax details amended. They wanted the Sertipikat, the IMB and the NameHolder's KTP details. What I have shown you is what I handed over. I am sure if it wasn't the real thing they would have said so. But they accepted it (a true copy, that is, by way of a memory stick transfer).

It was good to get a 'health check' on those docs as well.

The example you show above looks much more snazzy than mine so I'd be guessing a newer format and slightly different naming has been introduced since 2004. That I could believe easily. IJIN - IZIN - someone put their hand up one day in a Government meeting and suggested that change and everybody nodded. Mine is probably 'old style'. And that's cool with me. Collector's item!

And as for examples found on the internet, I treat them as recipes for banana cake. There are many variations.

If I were you I would be taking the Sertipikat to the Goverrnment Dept first and getting boned up on the details/requirements. And then to the developer, who may or may not be able to help you. But best luck with it. It will make for a great story when you have got it done and will be of value on this website for sure.

 

[paulseawind]

Well I don't understand why you're so confident to proclaim this. Your sentence seems to confirm that the IMB only pertains to the building.

Read my first 9 words above what you wrote at your post #26.

Yes, I agree, so why do you keep claiming the IMB pertains to the use of the land? If your land is zoned 'agricultural' you'll never get an IMB to build on it.

Read my post #25, paragraph 2. The answer lies in there.

 

[DenpasarHouse]

Read my first 9 words above what you wrote at your post #26.

Do you mean this?

I think this is being drilled into far too deeply.

C'mon mate, that's not doing anything to drive the discussion forward.

 

[paulseawind]

I am bowing out, DPH. Have a nice day.

And please let me know how you go with your IMB. I'd love to hear the story.

 

[DenpasarHouse]

Ah c'mon! We'd barely got our trousers off! Ha ha!

I'll let you know. I've got the blue plate, just not the certificate.

 

[paulseawind]

Ah c'mon! We'd barely got our trousers off! Ha ha!
I'll let you know. I've got the blue plate, just not the certificate.

Ha Ha
Hillbilly humour.

You're a nice bloke, DPH.

Yep, want to hear the outcome. Since you have that blue plate the rest should be 'easier'.

 

[DenpasarHouse]

Hillbilly humour.

I wouldn't let any militant, new atheists hear you say that. I stole it from Christopher Hitchens.

 

[Fred2]

In 2005 new laws were in acted because only 85% of all building had IMB certificates. Main problem TAX.
May be thats why you are showing different certificate. There are tables to show the process to obtain an IMB (zoning is part of the land certificate)
A number of documents are need to apply for a IMB
A land certificate including the relevant survey plan.
An ijing Kavling (permit to subdivide) if one is needed.
Correct land zoning for the building that is planned.*****BPN land parcel certificate will show Types of land rights B1-B4 ok for IMB, B5-B9 not ok for IMB
Drawings of the buildings that comply with local building regulations.
Structural and services drawings to make sure that the buildings have been properly designed and specified.
As markit stated before when buying land make sure the owner supplies a IMB permit with the sale of any land, don't want to find out later it is B5-B9
I hope that helps

 

[paulseawind]

I wouldn't let any militant, new atheists hear you say that. I stole it from Christopher Hitchens.

I steal lines all the time. I love it. I am a chronic line thief.
And I sometimes make variations so as to camouflage my trail of literary theft.
I haven't been busted yet and I have been at it for years and years.

I steal lines from movies, for example, and use them in conversation.
Blatantly and unashamedly.
I love it.

 

[paulseawind]

In 2005 new laws were in acted because only 85% of all building had IMB certificates. Main problem TAX.
May be thats why you are showing different certificate. There are tables to show the process to obtain an IMB (zoning is part of the land certificate)
A number of documents are need to apply for a IMB
A land certificate including the relevant survey plan.
An ijing Kavling (permit to subdivide) if one is needed.
Correct land zoning for the building that is planned.*****BPN land parcel certificate will show Types of land rights B1-B4 ok for IMB, B5-B9 not ok for IMB
Drawings of the buildings that comply with local building regulations.
Structural and services drawings to make sure that the buildings have been properly designed and specified.
As markit stated before when buying land make sure the owner supplies a IMB permit with the sale of any land, don't want to find out later it is B5-B9
I hope that helps

Excuse me, F2.
Where exactly are these B1-B4 and B5-B9 values shown??

 

[Fred2]

Look on your last land tax statement PBB, mine shows on the line to calculate land tax cost, you should have a BPN certificate Type of land rights: the original land zoning certifcate for the building would have been supplied with the application for the IMB, if you don't have a copy you need to apply to local BPN office.

 

[paulseawind]

Look on your last land tax statement PBB, mine shows on the line to calculate land tax cost, you should have a BPN certificate Type of land rights: the original land zoning certifcate for the building would have been supplied with the application for the IMB, if you don't have a copy you need to apply to local BPN office.

Nope. Mine just has the numbers. A value for BUMI from above (412jt) plus a value for BANGUNAN (733.2jt) totalled to 1.145.200.000
Then they apply a 20jt subtraction down to 1.125.200.000
They they charge me 0.2% of that figure and that is what I paid last time, because I changed the names in their database.
But, no Bx value to be seen.
I can see the use of PBB on 3 of the 4 pre-printed lines though.

I will have to wait until I get a regular Tax Invoice (later this year) and look then.
Or drop in and ask them.

Thanks for the info, Fred.