Villa, pondok wisata

[Slaer2001]

Hello,
I read a lot here about pondok wisata but didn't understand how to do?
We want to rent 3bdr villa on Bali, in first room we will live, last two rooms for renting out.
Which way better to choose?
1. Make pondok wisata to owner, register customers ourself, but in this case immigration may come.
2. To pay banjar every month
3. Ask some property company, like yours to make for me KITAS (I shall pay) like a villa manager, do everything myself and pay some money every month.
4. Set up PT company with license villa management, make a KITAS for me, make a pondok wisata on company. I know this is the best point, but for me it is expensive.
How to do?

 

[sakumabali]

Hi,

1. To get a pondok wisata you need to double check the zoning of the villa (not every villa can get one, oh and to make it even more frustrating the zoning always changing, so let's say you rent a place for years, apply and then suddenly you can't get one any more; also an awesome extra potential for corruption)
2. you can't get a working permit (not KITAS, guess that's what you meant) as a villa manager - it might work(ed) in big hotels but not for a single villa
3. try to make a kos kosan license and apply for a NPWPD (its not white but grey (semi legal) but probably your best shot. But forget the idea that your villa will gain you a permanent residence

 

[Slaer2001]

Thanks, Sakumabali,
1. Why I can't live on villa which I want to rent out?
2. What is it KOS KOSAN and NPWPD?
3. If I set up PT with villa management facility, make a pondok wisata for villa, make office on villa, hire local, he will meet a guests, takes a money, register guests by internet. In this case everything will be ok?

 

[sakumabali]

1. You can with a Kos Kosan Licence (that are these low cost rent rooms every where; the thing is - as it's sometimes quite impossible to get a Pondok Wisata due to the zoning - many villas for example in Jalan Kunti have all Kos2an Licences. Officially you can't have a pool with that but who cares ))) welcome to Indonesia). You need to register your guests (officially) in the 2 rooms and make a monthly tax declaration BUT just one time tax a year! That's MUCH more economic than Pondok Wisata as there the officials have a very high expectation regarding the return)
2. NPWP is an individual indonesian tax number, NPWPD is the same for a small business
3. you can do that BUT it's expensive, the company is owned by a local (that means he owns you) and FOR WHAT a 3 bedroom house?

 

[Slaer2001]

It is great, but how much kos2san license? Who will operates villa in this case me or not? Could I give adverts on airbnb if my villa with kos2san? Who will get NPWPD? Could immigration come?

 

[Markit]

What no one tells you before is how long the process will take and how much it will cost... noted? Guess what, nobody can say because there are so many pitfalls and people with their hand's out that can stop the whole process if they want to and on top of that it's basically illegal what you are trying to do.
Indonesia does not want foreigners coming here and opening up luxury villas or homestays for rental on international markets because (my personal opinion) they can't control what's being earned or who is getting it since most of the money transactions happen outside the country. At the moment they are casting a blind eye towards the issue because Bali is booming and international standards are only kept up by international owners. If all the villas that are for rental in Bali were all being run by the Balinese it would be a disaster and the Gov knows that. Maybe they see it as a "learning by doing" since all villas have Balinese staff?!

I'm trying to help some friends that are starting out the process of getting a PW and it is a nightmare!

If you do manage to get all the things/permits you are talking about then be prepared to not being able to touch one dish or lift one bed sheet because as foreign manager you are expressly forbidden from doing anything, you can manage and tell your staff what to do but you can't touch anything - legally.

The list of horrors goes on and on friend and if you are patient and have nerves of carbon steel you will eventually have your rental villa but the question you need to ask yourself is "why"? There are thousands of rental villas all over Bali and most have totally shitty occupation rates. The cheapass hotels in the south are all in a race for the bottom price-wise and since only the Chinese want to stay there it's really convenient that only Chinese seem to be flocking to Bali...

My advise: Build a wonderful place to live in a beautiful spot on this island (not worrying about rental value but what you like yourself) and do that for as long as you can each year - if you have to go back to somewhere to earn a crust then do that and make a long term rental out to people that will respect your house and Bali.

But what do I know?

 

[sakumabali]

Some valid points Markit,

yes you can rent out via Airbnb IF you do your tax reports (means if they catch you, you got something as a backup)
About the rest it's getting too specific you should talk with an agent / lawyer. Generally you can have a leasehold villa in your name, but the kos2an need an indonesian KTP. There are ways to do this. If immigration comes you can show them that you are the legal "leasehold owner" of the place. Good luck

 

[Slaer2001]

Some valid points Markit,

yes you can rent out via Airbnb IF you do your tax reports (means if they catch you, you got something as a backup)
About the rest it's getting too specific you should talk with an agent / lawyer. Generally you can have a leasehold villa in your name, but the kos2an need an indonesian KTP. There are ways to do this. If immigration comes you can show them that you are the legal "leasehold owner" of the place. Good luck

Do you mean that it is possible to rent villa on my name, rent out without any permits and if smbdy will come, give him a money?))

 

[Slaer2001]

Build a wonderful place to live in a beautiful spot on this island (not worrying about rental value but what you like yourself)

If I had money for build villa, I should never ask about rent. But now I have not to much money and I see many foreigners who lives on Bali and making rental business

 

[tel522]

Markit is absolutely correct , you need to be here to understand the problems you may face in the future, before you spend any serious money on a venture with dubious legality , quite large numbers of foreigners have invested here without understanding the difficulties , and of course lost everything ,and left some time later poorer !

 

[sakumabali]

No that's not what I'm saying...
First of all if you're limited on cash don't get into this business! If you're renting a nice place you don't really know what you're getting into (you can't x-ray the foundation, wiring, roof structure, plumbing)! There's ALWAYS something to fix...and if you can't pay for it, people won't rent your rooms...you need to have decent financial reserves to pull this off.
Second: if you find a good villa in a good location you won't be the only one who wants it that means it's gonna be (too) expensive.
You're competing with people who are well off and doing this as hobby to meet people and to fight boredom.
Third: Permits, of course you need an IMB (another problem as many of these "villas" won't have any) and all the rest to apply for a Kos2an.
You need the signatures of a lot of people (banjar, desa, camat) and all want money now and in the future. Possible they don't want to sign as balinese might see you as a competition next door AND/OR to raise the price! Because w/o their signature you can't rent legally! And surprise : they are knowing that!! If - for example - you paid the rent for "your" villa upfront for a couple of years (which you have to do, because if you won't your competitors will) you might get no permit! And if you rent out illegally your neighbors will send the pecalang / cops/ local mafia.

Bottom Line : if you don't have much money don't do it!