Crackdown on foreigners buying property in Bali and Lombok

davita

[COLOR=#303030][FONT=Arial]The Indonesian Agrarian law states: “Any attempt by a foreigner or a foreign entity to secure freehold land in any shape or form is void and the property belongs to the government”. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Tintin...can you give us a reference to your above quote as I've read the basic interpretation of UU2006 (Agrarian Law) which I'd archived and cannot find that reference. Link...http://faolex.fao.org/docs/pdf/ins3920.pdf I didn't have anything to do with the translation and my Indonesian sux....so I just take this translation at face value. Of particular interest is Part 3 Article 20;21 Also, Article 26 (2) is the point I've made on many previous posts....viz "Each sale and purchase, exchange gift, bequest by will and other acts which are meant to transfer the Right of Ownership directly or indirectly to a foreigner, to a national possessing a foreign nationality in addition to his/her Indonesian nationality, or a Corporation except 'Art21-2', are not valid by law. The provision that rights another party incumbent therein remain valid, and all payments received by the owner may not be reclaimed."

Smoke

ok here is the current Line up for the event .. The line-up at present looks like this: Kelompok Kerja Krisis Nominee Indonesia - Acting Chair Himpunan Advokat Muda Indonesia (HAMI) - National Board Member/Advocate (From Makassar) Law Professor (From HAMI) Ikatan Notaris Indonesia (INI) - Regional Chair Terje Nilsen - Director Ray White Paradise Property Group Deyong - Partner, Nahak, Deyong & Associates With additional panelists (lawyers, notaries, and hopefully one of the section heads from BPN Badung — The Land Registry). What they have to say is very interesting, and very, very positive. I think everyone will leave the event with a sense of relief, confidence, and clarity about what the laws and regulations (really) are, and how to comply with them, without going down any more blind alleys. Cheers, SEKRETARIAT K3NI-Bali Susan E. Johnston, MA, FRGS [email]sekretariat@k3ni-bali.org[/email] +62 8579 210 7443

Fred2

So what has happened with Susi Johnston and her nominee problems?

davita

Fred2 wroteSo what has happened with Susi Johnston and her nominee problems?

Someone could ask her at the seminar...according to Smoke's post she is the Secretary arranging that meeting on Thursday. [MENTION=670]tintin[/MENTION]. I note your ref is from an article written by a realtor....and your quote was his 'interpretation' not a 'translation' of the Agrarian Law.

Fred2

hans121 thats a good idea but were will the government start? Reading about k3ni it looks like there are a lot of people who have sign up, by notaris to the nominee system & think it was legal. So they are having a workshop on how to go forward. The Minister said there is a great deal of land in Indonesia, particularly in tourism areas such as Bali and Lombok, that it owned (illegally) by foreign nationals. In Bali and Lombok many foreigners control land through nominee landowners, using legally questionable powers of attorneys and fictive mortgage agreements. The Minister’s statement has many in the property sector concerned that land could be confiscated by the State or documents used to establish illegitimate foreign control of land declared invalid. The latter could create a windfall for the nominee who would then be established as the sole and rightful owner of the land. When Ferry was asked what sanctions can be imposed on foreign nationals known to illegally own land in Indonesia, the Minister replied “there is no sanction.” “There’s no need for sanctions, we will just divert possession of the land. We will ask if he has an Indonesian wife and divert the land to her. But, if he doesn’t have an Indonesian wife, then the land will be taken by the State,” Ferry explained.

davita

There is no such thing, in Indonesian law, as a 'nominee' system. That idea was invented by realtors, and some others, to sell property. The persons name on the title to any Hak Milik land in Indonesia must be an Indonesian National...end of story. The side agreements/contracts can be disputed in law but the title to the land is NOT in dispute. It belongs to the person whose name is on the Sertipikat Tanda Bukti Hak....heirs and successors. I have two of such Sertipikats in my possession and neither my name, nor my wife, is on any one of them...they are owned by close family members, who are Indonesian nationals, and we simply trust that our agreements will prevail. If either wish to renege there is very little, in law, we can do. I've argued this point so many times with expats but it's difficult to argue logic to those inclined to believe an agreement/contract can supersede Constitutional Law in Indonesia....it may be argued in other countries with more mature legal opinion...but Indonesia...good luck! Bali Discovery had a very good article on this subject in 2007. I commend another read as it is as relevant today...probably more so because of value increase...than then. Link...Bali News: Freehold Land Title for Foreigners in Bali: Caveat Emptor

JohnnyCool

Had a look at the Terry Magee link tintin sent. Stopped reading it after the first paragraph where Magee states that there are three ways for "foreigners to own property in Indonesia". (The first "way" is the usual Indonesian nominee stuff.) Whatever. This is the BS he writes about himself on his home page, with an astonishingly bland (ugly) image of what I presume is something he regards as "creative architecture". [QUOTE][I][B]...He invests in creative architecture that makes quality affordable. He commits himself to environmental sustainability...[/B][/I][/QUOTE] Certainly looks like it Tezza. :icon_eek:

tintin

Someone could ask her at the seminar...according to Smoke's post she is the Secretary arranging that meeting on Thursday. @tintin. I note your ref is from an article written by a realtor....and your quote was his 'interpretation' not a 'translation' of the Agrarian Law.

I apologize for having written "[COLOR=#303030][FONT=Arial]The Indonesian Agrarian law states", which obviously implies that it's a verbatim translation of the law. Obviously, Terry Magee has a dog in this fight, but his statement is certainly true. To think other wise is d[/FONT][/COLOR]elusional.

Braveheart_shaped_box

Fred2 wroteSo what has happened with Susi Johnston and her nominee problems?

She will be at the seminar [I]if[/I] she can find her broomstick to get there.

Fred2

last I had seen she was trying to go around the law by using civil law, the same as post-nup thing. I will find the post later & have a better look.

meerkat

hans121 wroteWhat I meant is this: How is the government gonna determine if the land is "indirectly" owned by a foreigner? If you have one of these "nominee agreements" in place, they have actual proof that you as a foreigner are trying to take ownership of the land. So I would deem it wise to terminate such an agreement now... don't you agree?

yes turn it into long term lease with right of renewal

meerkat

https://www.facebook.com/k3ni.org/photos/a.883885115007379.1073741828.882720305123860/911534572242433/?type=1&fref=nf K3NI is worth following this question and developments on

davita

meerkat wroteyes turn it into long term lease with right of renewal

This action is the one I heard from the Seminar. Has anyone investigated the cost to change the title to leasehold, and how much to return to Hak Milik, if an Indonesian subsequently wishes to buy? I suspect the Gov't and Notary costs would make this exercise very expensive. And would the owner of Hak Milik now be subject to tax on income from leasing his land.

spicyayam

[COLOR=#333333]And would the owner of Hak Milik now be subject to tax on income from leasing his land[/COLOR]

My understanding is that the government becomes the "owner" of the land. Some interesting points raised in the comments of this article: http://indonesiaexpat.biz/featured/foreign-property-ownership-under-the-magnifying-glass-in-indonesia/

JohnnyCool

[QUOTE][I]“There’s no need for sanctions, we will just divert possession of the land. We will ask if he has an Indonesian wife and divert the land to her. But, if he doesn’t have an Indonesian wife, then the land will be taken by the state.” [/I][/QUOTE] Well, Mr Baldan seems to have a "simple" answer to the issue. However, I wonder if he knows that an Indonesian woman married to a foreigner [I]without[/I] a prenuptial agreement is not allowed to own land in her own country? Stupidity at its finest in "Incredible Indonesia". I've been married to my wife for 12 years ([I]without[/I] a prenup). Not even sure there [I][B]was[/B][/I] such a "requirement" at the time we were married. We managed to buy two parcels of land in Jogjakarta years ago, and built a house on one of them. No problems then and sold both later. But now my wife can't own land. Way to go?

meerkat

This action is the one I heard from the Seminar. Has anyone investigated the cost to change the title to leasehold, and how much to return to Hak Milik, if an Indonesian subsequently wishes to buy? I suspect the Gov't and Notary costs would make this exercise very expensive. And would the owner of Hak Milik now be subject to tax on income from leasing his land.

a couple of links - the first to a court case running since 2001 and last word in 2013 - also involves lawyer peter Johnson of Austrindo Law Office Butler - OpenTrial.info the second a brief summary of regulations re right to use of land in Indonesia Regulations Ownership Indonesia | Terry Magee

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