rab
As expats living in Bali, the fine people on this forum are those who successfully made the transition to living in Bali. But what about those "ex expats" who did not become successful foreigners in paradise? Based on the folks you know who tried it but did not like it, what are the major reasons why a person does not succeed in becoming a long-term expat?
This question is coming from someone who will soon try to join y'all.
Thanks in advance for your wise observations...
pollyanna
What an interesting question! I don't know any ex expats personally but I'll be interested in any answers.
I have an Australian friend who is a top notch school teacher and has a lot of choice about where she lives. She has taught in Singapore and is now in Hong Kong. She is thinking about Bali. She tells me the expat life can be very alluring. After moving back to Australia for a few years she was ready to travel again.
spicyayam
I haven't really met anyone who left Bali because they didn't like it. Many expats have various complaints about living in Bali, but they still choose to live here. People sometimes have to go back home for health or money related issues. Sometimes people only plan to stay for a limited period. I have lived in a few different places and just because I decided to leave a country, I don't count that as being a "failure". Also, how do you define successfully living in Bali? Do you mean like starting a business here?
soontobeexpat
Jimbo wroteIf he ever gets caught he will have no trouble in going back to OZ :apologetic:
Very much so, I have only heard through the rumour mill about his current situation and apparently he is trying to nego his overstay fees down to 25 mil however I highly doubt the indo government would negotiate this kind of thing and allow you tp stay in your place.
He is too poor to live there and he is too poor to move home, he will have no place to stay, no job, no car nothing.. This story always scared me straight whern deciding when to go and when to stay.
phil170258
[b]head back when kids reach high school[/b]
My observation: a lot of families are fine in Bali when their kids are primary school age - in fact, all that paid help means they thrive in Bali, but when the kids get to high school age, they start to rethink their position. 14 yo kids here can hop on their motorbikes and head off to Kuta where'll they'll get served alcohol no problem. At the school my kids go to the primary classes are overflowing while the secondary classes are pretty thin so that would also suggest that lots of people head back home.
soontobeexpat
rab wroteAs expats living in Bali, the fine people on this forum are those who successfully made the transition to living in Bali. But what about those "ex expats" who did not become successful foreigners in paradise? Based on the folks you know who tried it but did not like it, what are the major reasons why a person does not succeed in becoming a long-term expat?
This question is coming from someone who will soon try to join y'all.
Thanks in advance for your wise observations...
I had wanted 8-12 months in bali but I left Bali after staying for 6 months due to money, health and my future.
Unfortunatley, so much money was going out however no money was coming back in and the purpose of my trip was to not be working simply exploring and discovering places I had wanted to go but never could because of time restraints.
My partner is Indonesian and for us, not for all to be successful we could not survive with children etc in Indonesia without opening a business which is a massive risk for people who are so young.
We both felt it was better coming to Australia and having long holidays in Indonesia then getting stuck in Indonesia.
I know of an "expat" in bali who has been living there for 12 years, he has not renewed his visa in 4 years due to the expense and is now too poor to ever come back to Australia.
Jimbo
soontobeexpat wroteI had wanted 8-12 months in bali but I left Bali after staying for 6 months due to money, health and my future.
Unfortunatley, so much money was going out however no money was coming back in and the purpose of my trip was to not be working simply exploring and discovering places I had wanted to go but never could because of time restraints.
My partner is Indonesian and for us, not for all to be successful we could not survive with children etc in Indonesia without opening a business which is a massive risk for people who are so young.
We both felt it was better coming to Australia and having long holidays in Indonesia then getting stuck in Indonesia.
I know of an "expat" in bali who has been living there for 12 years, he has not renewed his visa in 4 years due to the expense and is now too poor to ever come back to Australia.
If he ever gets caught he will have no trouble in going back to OZ :apologetic:
no.idea
spicyayam wrote People sometimes have to go back home for health or money related issues.
Spot on Spicyayam, The money would be the major hassle of many folk. I know a number of folks who have returned to their country or origin. (Actually most of these have returned to Australia). They underestimate the amount of money needed to stay here.
In the case of many of my Australian friends the return to Australia has been because of the Australian Government moving the goal posts on pensions. I moved to Indonesia at 45 years of age. The rules at that stage allowed me to receive the Australian aged pension when/if I turned 66. They deemed that 28 years of working and paying tax in Australia made me qualify for the aged pension.
However they have changed the rules so that we have to live in Australia for 2 years of the 5 years before retiring and applying for the aged pension. We can also go back at 66, stay there for 2 years until turning 68 and then leave Australia.
I still pay tax in Australian but can not imagine returning there after 21 years away.
Sadly a number of my friends had depended on this extra income and have had to return to Australia for the 2 years. (or for ever)
Fred2
Before for I decided to move over here I had planed, how much money I would need & that was hard to work out.
For the first two years it was a big change from Australia but now thing seem to be a lot easier:icon_mrgreen:.
You would have to have a income in your home country before you would even think of moving here (renting you house).
Most people I know have left because of money, they will say"I though it would be cheaper to live here" but I think there budget was way off.
I think most people have had a great holiday here & then think I will move to Bali without doing any research on what are the rules, How many people have asked on this forum, (I'm thinking of moving to Bali, how hard is it to get a JOB????)
soontobe you can negotiate your overstay fee if you have been here for a long time, some people have been here for more then 5 years without a visa.
When he has finish working out his fee, he will have to leave Indonesia. If he doesn't have the money for his ticket he will be lock up in immigration until he finds the money, Indonesia will not fund his repatriation back to Australia.
Adam
JC,
Your writing is always such a pleasure to read, real sage words from someone with genuine experience. As a tonic to potential boredom, have you ever considered writing a book about your experiences in Bali? After all, the place is one of the worlds great comedy shows while being genuinely serious, if that makes sense (or maybe, 'if it wasn't so serious, it would be a comedy show' is more appropriate???).
Just a thought? You are very much a gifted and hilarious wordsmith, in my opinion.
Regards,
Adam
JohnnyCool
Hi [B]Adam[/B]
Thank you for your kind words.
[QUOTE]As a tonic to potential boredom, have you ever considered writing a book about your experiences in Bali?[/QUOTE]
Yes...lots of times.
How about [I]Fear And Loafing in Bali[/I]? (Still a work in progress.) [I]The Village of Ten Thousand Mirrors[/I] (ditto).
[I]How To Be A Procrastinator And Still Get Ahead[/I]. Or perhaps [I]How To Build Your Own Balinese Temple[/I].
You know [I]most[/I] of the time I don't have time to be bored. I believe "boredom" is a useless personal affliction. So much to do, so much to see, so many traffic accidents to avoid, so many girls, so little time...
:icon_biggrin:
Adam
Ha ha ha! Love it!
JohnnyCool
[QUOTE]...what are the major reasons why a person does not succeed in becoming a long-term expat? [/QUOTE]
Money, health issues, poor educational facilities (for the most part), terminal culture shock, and boredom.
[B]Money[/B] is obvious. You can't live here on nothing. Some "[B]eeps[/B]" (ex-expats) I know were involved in businesses with Balinese partners/lovers. Some were ripped-off badly and left in disgust. Some decided to leave with their Balinese partners for better job opportunities in a different and developed country.
[I]
Some examples:[/I]
Woman with successful restaurant in Bali, married to a Balinese - they had children - the husband became seriously religious and eventually became the head priest of a major temple in North Bali. They all moved to Australia after several years where they operate a restaurant there (including the priest).
A woman becomes involved with a Balinese and his young son. Works her butt off to support them all. Tried a restaurant business for a while. Hubby was a lazy layabout with constant excuses and then started having affairs with younger (expat) women. She returned to Australia and might come back, when she has enough money to try again.
Several male eeps in "love" discover that their girlfriends have multiple overseas "sponsors", become disillusioned, jealous and leave. Some even had children - not always their own. Same with some female eeps - all kinds of dramas trying to get their children away from the Balinese families they were married in to.
[B]Health[/B] issues are also self-explanatory. Sooner or later, we all get sick or injured and need quality medical intervention. Most of the hospitals here are a bad joke and many doctors are simply incompetent. Period. If you think the private hospitals are better, think again. A [I]few[/I] [B]are[/B] passable, but usually expensive. No health insurance? Don't get seriously sick here.
Several eep friends of mine “left” because they died of natural causes or were killed in traffic accidents.
[B]Schooling[/B]. There are some excellent schools in Bali, none of them cheap. Local schools are a mixed bag, some better than others. The worst ones are where your child is taught to recite stuff like a parrot.
[B]Culture shock[/B]. Nearly every expat experiences this in varying degrees. Most get over it in time but some never do and become increasingly depressed and “home-sick”. Many areas are heavily dependent upon tourism. After a while, you realise you’re tending to go from one bar/restaurant to another. It can become boring.
[B]Boredom[/B] can become a serious issue if people can’t find enough things to keep themselves stimulated. Feelings of “loneliness” are also not uncommon, along with perceptions that one is [B]not[/B], after all, a “Balinese” and doesn’t [I]really[/I] belong here. Of course, everybody’s mileage is different. You can be surrounded by local people and still feel lonely. For some, it becomes too much.
Visa issues, visa runs, dealing with officials (police, immigration, banjars, extended families, utility providers, etc), also take their toll. All under tropical heat, high humidity, rising prices, growing traffic jams and rampant stupidity (“ignorance?”).
I [I]think[/I] I’ve been here about 16 years, so far. No, the footprints on my toilet seats are not my own.
Why do I stay? I still love the place (not as much as before), and love challenges. There sure are a lot of them in Bali.
[I]Hey, Wayan! I made up a new word today..."eeps". What do you think of it?
"Eeps possible. Heineken, Bintang or Red Label?"[/I]
See what I mean?
:icon_rolleyes:
rab
Great information! Thanks, all!
Tamispecial
JohnnyCool wroteMoney, health issues, poor educational facilities (for the most part), terminal culture shock, and boredom.
[B]Money[/B] is obvious. You can't live here on nothing. Some "[B]eeps[/B]" (ex-expats) I know were involved in businesses with Balinese partners/lovers. Some were ripped-off badly and left in disgust. Some decided to leave with their Balinese partners for better job opportunities in a different and developed country.
[I]
Some examples:[/I]
Woman with successful restaurant in Bali, married to a Balinese - they had children - the husband became seriously religious and eventually became the head priest of a major temple in North Bali. They all moved to Australia after several years where they operate a restaurant there (including the priest).
A woman becomes involved with a Balinese and his young son. Works her butt off to support them all. Tried a restaurant business for a while. Hubby was a lazy layabout with constant excuses and then started having affairs with younger (expat) women. She returned to Australia and might come back, when she has enough money to try again.
Several male eeps in "love" discover that their girlfriends have multiple overseas "sponsors", become disillusioned, jealous and leave. Some even had children - not always their own. Same with some female eeps - all kinds of dramas trying to get their children away from the Balinese families they were married in to.
[B]Health[/B] issues are also self-explanatory. Sooner or later, we all get sick or injured and need quality medical intervention. Most of the hospitals here are a bad joke and many doctors are simply incompetent. Period. If you think the private hospitals are better, think again. A [I]few[/I] [B]are[/B] passable, but usually expensive. No health insurance? Don't get seriously sick here.
Several eep friends of mine “left” because they died of natural causes or were killed in traffic accidents.
[B]Schooling[/B]. There are some excellent schools in Bali, none of them cheap. Local schools are a mixed bag, some better than others. The worst ones are where your child is taught to recite stuff like a parrot.
[B]Culture shock[/B]. Nearly every expat experiences this in varying degrees. Most get over it in time but some never do and become increasingly depressed and “home-sick”. Many areas are heavily dependent upon tourism. After a while, you realise you’re tending to go from one bar/restaurant to another. It can become boring.
[B]Boredom[/B] can become a serious issue if people can’t find enough things to keep themselves stimulated. Feelings of “loneliness” are also not uncommon, along with perceptions that one is [B]not[/B], after all, a “Balinese” and doesn’t [I]really[/I] belong here. Of course, everybody’s mileage is different. You can be surrounded by local people and still feel lonely. For some, it becomes too much.
Visa issues, visa runs, dealing with officials (police, immigration, banjars, extended families, utility providers, etc), also take their toll. All under tropical heat, high humidity, rising prices, growing traffic jams and rampant stupidity (“ignorance?”).
I [I]think[/I] I’ve been here about 16 years, so far. No, the footprints on my toilet seats are not my own.
Why do I stay? I still love the place (not as much as before), and love challenges. There sure are a lot of them in Bali.
[I]Hey, Wayan! I made up a new word today..."eeps". What do you think of it?
"Eeps possible. Heineken, Bintang or Red Label?"[/I]
See what I mean?
:icon_rolleyes:
Well said and quite to the point....i have only lived here for 2 years and so far cannot imagine wanting to live anywhere else......i think it's just a matter of getting used to your new surroundings and leaving your western past...in the past.
I am sorry that 'soon to be' has had her dreams shattered....i remember when she first started asking questions and being so looking forward to her new life.....i hope one day she can return and fulfil her dream.
soontobeexpat
Tamispecial wroteWell said and quite to the point....i have only lived here for 2 years and so far cannot imagine wanting to live anywhere else......i think it's just a matter of getting used to your new surroundings and leaving your western past...in the past.
I am sorry that 'soon to be' has had her dreams shattered....i remember when she first started asking questions and being so looking forward to her new life.....i hope one day she can return and fulfil her dream.
Thanks Tami :) but I have to say by no means was I upset I came back to Aus, Im so happy I have done it and got to experience everything I did in that amount of time. It felt good to come home for some reason, I thought it would be devastating but it was so nice touching back down in Australia.
I guess it is similar to the old saying better to have been "Tis better to have loved and lost / Than never to have loved at all." I am so lucky & so fortunate to have done this really.
