Indonesian airlines cleared for US flights

YPDN

davita wroteI take it you're an aircraft and wiki enthusiast, as am I. You might wish to note that in the specs quoted in wiki it says under ISA conditions (International Standard Atmosphere)...that means +15 dec Celcius. Bali is never under ISA conditions and outside air temps (OAT's) of +30 to +35Deg negatively changes those take-off length parameters dramatically.

Declaring ISA can be considered a cop-out and I don't think the B787 people are into that. B787s operate in 'non-ISA' spaces very often. To say they only work to spec under ISA conditions is not so good. I am now curious to see the actual calcs to see where in the envelope this puts the ACFT. And, there is no mention of fuel on board. (Depends where the bird is headed, really) There is no mention of headwinds in all this. They are both good and bad. Good if you are operating normally and wanting that beautiful (gratis) lift. Bad if you really don't want anything to slow your takeoff roll at all. ISA conditions, calm air, perfect balance relative to the C of G, etc, they are a set of pipe dreams and how many times do all those things make themselves available when you need them.

davita wroteAlso, by building that Nusa Dua toll road, they've effectively killed any extension to R'way 09/27 or ability to add a second parallel runway out thru' Benoa Bay. IMO they could have considered running a tunnel near the airport for cars and have the aircraft taxy over the top...just like Changi in Singapore.

My recollection is that it was Hindu-related mostly. The Hindu honchos have said Nope to the airport putting RWYs over/thru sacred sites there. And the powers that be have accepted it. But what would I know. Perhaps a tunnel is actually on the drawing boards? It would cost less than a new airport in the north.

davita

Re post # 18 by YPDN Your wiki link said that a B787-8 requires 3100 metres and a B787-9 needed 2900 metres therefore Bali was within those parameters. I asked if you had the Regulated T.O Weight data (RTOW) as I haven't used them since retiring from the business 26 years ago and wanted to challenge my memory Every A/C and airport has to be adjusted by applying the RTOW data to the situation on the ground. This is what pilots do at briefings in Flight Ops before getting to the aircraft...sometimes they are even further adjusted, in the cockpit, if the weather or A/C weight changes significantly. I suggested to geedee if Bali's OAT is constantly well above ISA then I doubt a fully-loaded B787 can take-off from Bali's 3000 metre runways 09/27....given wiki's above info. They would need to reduce the fuel load (limiting range) or cargo (limiting revenue) or passengers (limiting revenue) thus making it ineffiecient for that A/C to fly to Bali, compared to other types. Bali has caused its own problems in this regard so a new airport on a floating barge off Singeraja seems their only answer....gotta laff...:icon_e_biggrin:

geedee

Markit wroteGet a room, you two!

Preferably with good soundproofing

geedee

Davita i,m a bit confused about fully loaded 787-8 landing in Bali Jetstar land 787-8 every day in Bali fully loaded.

davita

geedee wroteDavita i,m a bit confused about fully loaded 787-8 landing in Bali Jetstar land 787-8 every day in Bali fully loaded.

Landing from a flight isn't the issue so long as landing below Max Landing Weight (MLW) I doubted if the same B787 return non-stop flight to USA could Take-Off from Bali's 3000 metre runway with the A/C at Max T.O. Weight (MTOW) with fuel for range and max passengers/cargo for revenue. If they had to interim stop then the B787 capability is moot as many other A/C types can do that.

YPDN

davita wroteYour wiki link said that a B787-8 requires 3100 metres and a B787-9 needed 2900 metres therefore Bali was within those parameters. I asked if you had the Regulated T.O Weight data (RTOW) as I haven't used them since retiring from the business 26 years ago and wanted to challenge my memory

Sorry - can't help but I'd be really interested to see the results of such calcs.

davita wroteI suggested to geedee if Bali's OAT is constantly well above ISA then I doubt a fully-loaded B787 can take-off from Bali's 3000 metre runways 09/27....given wiki's above info.

Looking at this from the side now, there is 'the band' of desirable places. That is, 15degN thru 15degS. I think that includes the Bahamas? It certainly includes wonderfully climated areas. For the Dreamliner to have operational issues in these places is crazy. I doubt they ever get down to 15C. The B787 was supposed to be the final word on lightweight fuselages (carbon fibre), the appropriate wings married into that, and supreme operational abilities in smaller areas. Airbus countered with the A380 around that time.

davita wroteBali has caused its own problems in this regard so a new airport on a floating barge off Singeraja seems their only answer....gotta laff...:icon_e_biggrin:

Yeah. But the fat lady hasn't sung on that one yet. And no matter what ends up being 'the way to go', not everyone will agree. The K/bahan solution into the Bali Sea will require mammoth amounts of tanah (soil) forming thousands of truckloads which at so many trucks per day would take a long time to deliver. The canucks are probably aware of that by now. Earlier that year the Governor declared an upper limit on land being cleared on Bali and if you imagine a big hole for that dirt to come from, well, it's huge. Sumberkima sounds like a better option, IMHO. But it's so remote. It's near Patriq's place.

davita

Aaagh the good 'ole days tintin...did you smoke yourself or were you inundated with people smoking while you were eating your food galore... :grumpy: Somethings are best forgotten.

tintin

In the '80s and early 90's, I flew countless times LA - DPS (LA- HNL- Biak - DPS), with Garuda, on DC10's. Lots of fun: great service, food and booze galore (top labels only), and good entertainment, free, of course. I was always looking forward to these long flights! Always met and had good conversations with many interesting people, along the way. Then, when GA went out of business, it was BOS - NY - FRA - SIN - DPS, on Singapore, which used Boeings (but I don't remember the types) : again, super service all around (but no Return "upgrades" possible ;o((). At the stop-overs in Biak [I]Bandara Frans Kaisiepo[/I], with GA, on the return flights, I was always amazed by the "security" there (well, there was no need for it, at the time). The passengers would rush to the souvenir stand and many would re-embark, "armed" with native bows and arrows, spears, long knives purchased at the stand...

tintin

davita wroteAaagh the good 'ole days tintin...did you smoke yourself or were you inundated with people smoking while you were eating your food galore... :grumpy: Somethings are best forgotten.

Actually, I don't remember large clouds of smoke in the plane, but smoking was, as you know, permitted, maybe only in the back rows (?) On the way to Bali, I did not smoke because I did not have kreteks, but on the way back, I would be finishing my pack during the flight. In the US I did not smoke anything. I had tried some (expensive) kreteks that one could buy in a tobacco shop in Cambridge, but they did not taste the same to me as in Bali (actually not good at all, go figure!?). But in Bali, I smoked 1 - 1 &1/2 packs/day of Djarum and later on, "Exporrrrt" (Gudang Garam, International). As I stepped off the plane at Ngurah Rai, the ubiquitous smell of the kreteks mixed with that of the flowers in the air --the smell of Indonesia, overpowered me, and I was hooked once more...

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