Bali Expat Forum - Bali Travel Forum

OK, here I come with my two-cent worth. In Bali, there are many types of ceremonies, including the some dozen manusia yadnya, which focus on the manusia (the human being), and which include among others, the tooth filing and the wedding ceremonies. As in the West, these ceremonies are PRIVATE, and one can only attend upon a personal invitation from the family involved. Would it make any sense for me to invite a bus-load of Japanese tourists visiting Boston, to witness, for a fee, my American son's wedding, or the Christian baptism of my grand daughter?

I would add that these ceremonies are not like the ngaben, the cremation ceremony, where any Tom, Dick or Harry can attend from the outside, in full anonymity, the actual cremation of the "body," the almost final act of the whole ceremony (but I must point out that a cremation is not a manusia yadnya per se, so maybe this is why: I don't know because I've never asked).

As pointed out by Roy in details, these ceremonies are, like most activities taking place in a village, a banjar's, affair. As an outsider, being invited to attend a particular ceremony also means to participate in that celebration. In many cases, if one is not too familiar with what exactly goes on and cannot readily offer his or her "labor," the simplest participation for such a guest is to contribute toward covering some of the expenses of the ceremony, which in general are substantial. There is absolutely no stigma attached to bringing an envelop with a contribution, and there is no need to do it discretely. It is appreciated for what it is: a genuine participation in the celebration.

Hi mileage,

I am glad that you have enjoyed your time at a Balinese ceremony.

culture, the faith and the customs may dwindle due to the increasing costs of keeping them.

This fear has been expressed since Bali became a tourist destination in the 1920s/1930s. Although, many things have changed – some for the better and some not so desirable, the collapse or lost of Balinese culture hasn’t happened. I believe it will never happen! As long as the Balinese are proud and appreciate their root. You can read a great deal about this topic being analyzed, examined and reexamined by many scholars.

There are however many factors that are currently undermining the Balinese culture longevity.
- Cost of ceremonies is certainly one of them. As the prices of produce etc increased due to tourism, fuel hike etc.

- An introduced working culture that does not complement the existing tradition. For example, many people working in the tourism industries (especially the service industries) are finding it hard to get the time off work to meet their community and temple obligations. Also there are many businesses owned by Westerners and other Indonesian that look down upon staff who are taking too many days off. “Balinese are taking to many time off for ceremonies” “Ceremonies, ceremonies…”! I have heard this expressed in this forum in the past. You will hopefully understand this better when you read more of my posting later. I guess working 8am – 5pm every day and 10 days to two weeks of leave a year is not going to cover all these ceremonies, let alone time for holiday. Well this is what my friends told me, if you know difference, then you can tell me differently.

- Knowledge not passed down. Many of the ceremonies are very complex requiring complex offerings. Perhaps younger generations are not taking so much interest in learning how to make these complex offerings. This problem is exacerbated by ready availability of offerings to be purchased. I am not talking about the Canang for daily offering sold in the market. A family can now practically order almost everything required for a wedding or cremation with only some basics and fresher requirements made at home. This reduces preparation time and cost to some extend. I guess it also creates a service industry. But what will happen then?

Alright then, indeed there are so many ceremonies in Bali and Roy and Tintin have given some insight into this. So I will just add some here. However, you must understand that it is very hard for outsiders to comprehend just how much and how complicated the ceremonies, the customs and the culture are in Bali. It is almost impossible for an outsider to get good comprehension even when he/she is living there, let alone when you are only visiting as a tourist. Unless you are very motivated to be immersed in the culture, speak not only Indonesian, most importantly Balinese, only then will you have a better chance to get an impression of the daily life of the average Balinese (Hindu). (or get a very good translator!!). I don’t mean to offend anybody with this statement.

Btw Mileage, what bahasa (language) did you learn? Is it Bahasa Indonesia or Bahasa Bali?

Some might be interested to read Sarad – a magazine discussing and presenting many things Balinese and Hindu. It discusses development concerns from the point of view of Balinese, the impacts of tourism, modernism, globalization etc. It is in Indonesian with some Balinese phrases and words intermixed. http://www.saradbali.com

Before I forget and for information, there is a way people can donate if they wish when visiting or invited to a temple ceremony. During a temple ceremony, there is usually a place where the congregations and visitors can put Dana Punia (donations) for the temple. This can be just a simple box with Dana Punia written on it either in Balinese writing and Latin alphabet or/and a pavilion within the temple compound where some men would sit and write down donations received from congregations.

Please don’t get the wrong idea that this is another Balinese scamming mechanism to get money from tourists. This is not set up for tourists!! It is not to buy your way into the temple, an entrance fee or as payment for being invited to the temple. This is part of the Dharma of giving that is encourage to all Balinese Hindhu. This donations will go towards, temple maintenance and renovations.

So not sure where to start to give you some insights into the many ceremonies we have in Bali

Anyway, I’ll try as there seem to be an interest and a need here now.

There are 5 types of ceremonies in Bali – called Panca Yadnya:
1. Dewa Yadnya – offerings, prayers and sacrifices for the God. This include: Temple ceremonies, family temple ceremonies
2. Pitra Yadnya – offerings, prayers and sacrifices for the ancestors. This include Ngaben (cremation ceremonies) Nyekah (purification ceremony that follows cremation)
3. Rsi Yadnya – offerings to sages. This includes ceremonies and visit to high priests, ceremonies when a person becomes a priest.
4. Manusa Yadnya – offerings and sacrifices to people and society including all the rite of passages (12 days, 3 months, first six months anniversary for babies, tooth filing, wedding).
5. Butha Yadnya – offerings to nature and its spirits and guardians. Including Mecaru (sacrifices e.g. during Pangrupukan day – 1 day before Nyepi). Tumpek ceremonies (offering for the animals, tools, etc).

All are interlinked and components either in part or whole for each type.
So all of these types of ceremonies occur at various cycle. For example:
- Daily offering: Saiban (rice and whatever is cooked for the day’s meal) and Canang (flower in cocunut basket) ~ several thousands rupiahs.
- Every 15 Days: Kajeng Kliwon. Offering includes Canang, fruit, cakes, ketupat and a small offering for the village temple. ~ Rp 20,000 – Rp 50,000 depending on the family
- Every 30 Days: Purnama (full moon) & Tilem (New Moon). ~ Rp 50,000. Offering include Canang, fruit, cakes, purification offering
- Every 210 Days: Galungan, Kunginan, Saraswati, Pagerwesi, and many more. ~ Rp 300,000 – Rp 500,000 (or more depends on family capacity).
- Also temple anniversary festivals – family temple, subak temple, banjar temple, clan temple, village temples (Pura Desa, Pura Dalem, Pura Puseh), and many more.
- Every 1 lunar year: Nyepi, Siwatratri.

Well, what else can I say here on this already very long posting!

A Balinese family is a member of several social groupings that has predetermined rules, rights and obligations – all members contribute the same set of materials and money called Turunan. All are compulsory (e.g. compulsory time (it can be just a day or several weeks) and attendance to provide man power, materials contribution to ceremonies, yearly member contribution fee and offering). Those more able are then able to donate more if they wish so.

So what are these groups? These are based on what I know of from my village in Peliatan – customs might differ slightly in other areas.

1. A Tempekan – a social organization on a street by street level. This perhaps only occurs if the Banjar is large enough. The group members help each other to prepare large ceremonies, weddings, tooth filing, cremations ~ Rp 10millions is perhaps a bare minimum for these ceremonies. A cremation ceremony can run to Rp 50 millions and more and depends on how elaborate the ceremony is and how important the person was in live, status and caste of the family (which determine the type of offerings needed and the vehicle for the funeral pyre).

2. Banjar – a social organization that has often been mentioned here. Usually, it will have around several hundreds families. The support in terms of helping members to prepare ceremonies is the same as above but on a larger scale. The difference is for example in the case of a family/private cremation ceremony, not all of the Banjar members must attend to provide man power in the preparation of the ceremony, but all members must attend at the last two days of the final execution of the ceremony (the purification ceremony at home and the ceremony at the cemetery) and provide support with the gamelan. If the family do request the support of the whole Banjar for the preparation time, then the family must also be prepared for the cost that this will involve and will usually cause the cost of the ceremony to skyrocket. This is because, Banjar members are there to support the family, but they must also be hosted by the family and provided with the traditional meals, welcome coffee and cakes, cigarettes etc during the time they are there to support the family and plus provide gift (traditional food) delivered to their house.

However, when a communal cremation ceremony is organised by the Banjar, families involved combined all resources and therefore can saved on the costs of the ceremony. However, it is still several millions for each family at the very least.

3. A Balinese family is also member of at least several temples (village temple, clan temple (s), Subak temple (s) for farmers). All members must contribute yearly or six monthly contribution fees, compulsory materials contribution for festivals, compulsory offering contributions, time and manpower to prepare the temple festivals. Other fees can also be charged if congregations decide to do renovation, purchase a gamelan etc.

4. And then there are also the pilgrimages to the Mother Temple of Besakih and the Sad Kahyangan temples scattered around Bali and other island wide important temples in Bali. Some even do pilgrimage to temples in Java.

Phewww – there are heaps more. Just let me know if you are not yet overwhelmed

too long and hopefully my English is comprehensible

Kadek

Thanks Roy!

For mileage,
I apologise for my broken English!

For Markit,
nothing

No need to apologize Thorten,
Things certainly got heated. Far more so after that comment of yours. It was my intension to keep it constructive.
Kadek, you are a goddess! Thanks for taking the time to clarify the circumstances of Bali life. That is exactly the information that I was interested in finding out. I studied bahasa Indonesia intensively, however I was too scared to use it until I made my friendships in Bali. I get encouraged every trip to use it. Aku suka coba coba sekali. Like a giant sponge, I soak up all things Bali, history, culture, language. Never overwhelmed! Always interested......

To the other fellas, 'sin ken ken'

Indeed! Kadek! Matur suksma! To your suggestion of Sarad, I would like to suggest two other essential books, both in English.

BALI, LIVING IN TWO WORLDS. Edited by the noted Swiss scholar Urs Ramseyer and the Balinese scholar, I Gusti Raka Panji Tisna. This also includes a photo essay by the brilliant photographer, Rama Surya. Published by Schwabe in Basel, ISBN 3-7965-1873-7. This MUST READ book is a compilation of some 16 essays written by various Balinese scholars which deals head on with precisely the issues Kadek mentions...Bali as in the world today. Some essay titles:

-Sociology of the Temple...Issues Related to Rivalry in Status and Power

-The Dangerous Dream of a “Golden Age”

-Language and Identity...Between Globalisation and Illiteracy

-Tears in Paradise?

-The Loss of the Last Paradise?

-The Triangle of Denial, Indifference and Silent Hope...Drug Abuse and Prostitution in Bali

The second book which is perhaps even more essential for anyone wanting to learn more about Balinese culture, it’s unique Hindu/Buddhist approach, customs, ceremonies, etc is the also MUST READ masterwork by Fred B. Eiseman, Jr. titled BALI, SEKALA & NISKALA. This is published by Periplus and now in its fourth or fifth printing. ISBN 0-945971-03-6.

Both of these books are easily found on the internet, or here in Bali at any of the Periplus book shops.

To what Kadek has explained, I would like to add a couple of observations. One is that even within Bali, many variations of offerings and ceremonies can be found from regency to regency, and even with villages within the same regency. Additionally, variations can also be found by caste, of which there are four in Bali and within them, further subdivisions. As indicated by Kadek, this is all very complicated. The reality is that the average Balinese, as member of the Sudra caste is normally not as educated or as knowledgeable on any of these religious matters as would be a Balinese of the Brahmana caste. It is very common for Balinese of the Sudra caste to consult with their high priest as to which offerings are necessary for which particular ceremonies.

As a final and humorous note, around our village there is an old expression that one will often hear which is, “Galungan, Kuningan, money gone.” The expression is always followed by a smile or a little laugh.

Around our village there's a humorous expression too:

"Yankee go home!"

Funny comment Markit. It reminds me of what my father, who flew B-17s out of bases in England during WWII used to say was a common saying by the English at that time about Americans. “They are over paid, over sexed, and over here!”

Good luck on your first trip to Bali Markit. Unless you are totally blind, it will be an eye opener. Cheers!

You know Markit, if you had any class or appreciation for Bali at all, you would have acknowledged Kadek’s post by now...which you haven’t.

To me, that speaks volumes. IMHO, Thor’s hammer struck the nail solidly when he first posted on this string. If anyone disagrees with me, please speak up.

But, hey Markit! I’ve got a proposition for you concerning your “Expat Rule No. 1". If you are a man who is willing to put his money where his mouth is, this should be very appealing to you.

How about on your upcoming trip to Bali, I meet you at Naughty Nuri’s and take you to my village. We’ll walk compound to compound and offer your free “mother ship” ride to each adult we find home. Then we’ll walk down to the Royal Pita Maha where a lot of the adults in our village work.

You offer them the free ride on the “mother ship” to anywhere they want in Europe or the US...understanding that this also means permanent residency there. For everyone that says “yes” I’ll give you $100.00. For everyone who says “no” you give me $10.00. That is ten to one in your favor. By my calculations, at the end of the day, I’ll be about $2,500 richer, and you...$2,500 poorer.

So, what do you say? Are you man enough to put your money where your mouth is, or are you going to cop out as I expect?

Unlike you Roy I don't always think that submissions from other members here require my permission or evaluation - I read her article with interest and that was good enough.

I would refer you and anyone else that believes a word you say to:

http://bali-expat-forum-f2/the-expat-su ... 20796.html

Go with God, but Go!

I've already been to that ridiculous post, and I have left my reply there.

Your are one heck of a funny mad hatter sort of fellow Markit, and I must say, I am enjoying the Dickens (oops) out of making you look more and more foolish.

Markit, what is up with you?????? You seem to have a perpetual crutch on your shoulder. You are partially correct regarding tourists offering an envelope (money) whether it be at a temple or a village ceremony as a jesture of respect for being allowed to participate in said ceremony. However, to publicly advertise, any and all ceremonies, which Kadek so eloquently mentioned in her previous post, (that is, to help in the cost of preparation, is not acceptable in the Balinese Culture). I Gusti Agung just told me "oh no Balinese would feel quilty about doing something like that, to ask for money from tourists to observe a ceremony would make the balinese people feel quilty.)

Bottom line from what I can gather, when a tourist or outsider gives freely as an observer and or participient, no problem; however, to require observers to pay a certain fee would be unholy in the Balineses eyes; thereby creating an unholiness to said ceremony.

In essence, the vibration of the ceremony would be effected. Markit, your idea is not bad, simply you need to go to Bali, live in a village amongst the people, for at least a year. I am certain your entire perspective will drastically be altered forever more. A conversion one might say. Roy is right, most Balinese would not want to leave their native home. You gotta be there to understand, if you know what I mean.

Few cultures share a oneness of community which the Balinese People weave into their daily existance. The banjar and the temple are the two major factors I believe which sustains the unique culture in Bali. As Agung said, if someone does not have the funds to participate in a ceremony the banjar, neighborhood, family andfriends all give something to help said family to continue the rituals required of their culture. However, to publicly advertise to the tourist for a fee, no dice!!!!

By the way, I thought you were married for many years? In this string you now say your wife to be??? What happened?

Judy, the event I talked about happened many years ago - then, she was my wife to - be.

I cannot help myself, but Markit on this forum always reminds me to the pope in a swinger club!

I cannot help myself, but Markit on this forum always reminds me to the pope in a swinger club!

But let’s have a look on some facts:

He is talking about Balinese ceremonies – but he has never seen one!
He is making suggestions what the Balinese should do – although he never (?) met a Balinese!
His theoretical speculation is very controversy to any, experienced advice – but he never spent one minute on Bali!
He thinks to know what Balinese would like to do – based on logical thinking in lack of any personal exchange!

So you found Kadek’s post interesting Markit? Fine!

So you think you’ve learned something and gained some knowledge about Balinese ceremony procedures?

Let me tell you something Markit, despite you will probably not want to listen – you will never ever understand this (just like I won’t) – you are allowed to attend, you are welcomed, you can contribute in the one or other way, but you will not comment, criticise, dare to interfere!
Balinese people are very polite and humble, but they will lose their (great sense of) humour when it comes to religion!

When Kadek mentioned Dana Punia, then this will probably a good chance to embarrass yourself – you might think to get rid of some of these dirty, rotten 1,000 Rps notes there, but then the guy at “counter” (or whatever it’s called) won’t let you go, he will present you a list or a book, you are asked to write your name, sum of donation and sign it (yes-they even have accounting for temple donations), after providing him your couple of crappy notes you will read the sums of donations offered by others and you will be amazed (I’m not talking about tourists)!

At the moment Markit, you cannot even contribute anything for touristy topics in regard to Bali, let alone any cultural issues and I also doubt you will get any further with your attitude – maybe we should send you for a consulting at Kadek’s father – Bapak Nesa is not only a priest and frequented a lot by Balinese for consulting, he is also a traditional healer, an art teacher and an former artist ( before you are too drunk shuffle over the street at Nuri’s , he is also exposed in Neka museum, but his work is exposed there under the name of his father, who was one of the most rewarded artists of Indonesia and a favourite of former IR President Soekarno, so his work is even to see in a building in Manhattan, designed by one of my beloved architects – Oskar Niemeyer, the UN headquarter!)

Markit,
Perhaps you would be a' Type 5 Expat'. I'll bite my tongue on that one!
To all others,THANK YOU,a very informative and interesting post! Kadek,kamu menulis halus,dan bagus!

Ok, I'll bite. What is a Type 5? Please feel free to add it to the list.

Thorsten, you scare me . All the other Germans that I've met with your world view have mostly gotten it through the bottom of a beer glass or the window of a tank - which are you?

I could think of several characteristic that could define a “type 5” expat, but speaking of 5s...well done on terminal 5 at Heathrow. 72 hours since it opened and a SNAFU if I ever saw one!