Bali Expat Forum - Bali Travel Forum

I have recently had the unfortunate experience of trying to do business with a bunch of cowboys called BCA bank and I wanted to let you all know that they are incompetent at best and, most likely, crooked.

I have a villa business and wanted to accept credit cards. We approached BCA and they said we could rent a credit card machine from them for a fixed monthly charge of 150.000 Rupiah. We repeatedly asked if there were any other charges, and the answer always came back "no". So we jumped through all the hoops (opening accounts, submitting to a "survey" by 5-or-so bank staff, etc.) and waited for them to bring the machine...

and we waited...

...and waited...

...and waited...

...until finally, after repeatedly chasing them and getting them to correct details that that they had twice got wrong, some 6 weeks after applying, they turned up with the machine. Just before they plugged it in, I asked them to once again to confirm that there were no charges apart from the monthly rental. Suddenly, the answer was different. Now, after gaining our commitment and putting us in a position where it was hard to back out, they told us we would be charged 2.5% for every transaction!

We phoned the head office who didn't seem to be aware of this fact. In the end, they offered us a "discount" - bringing the charge down to a mere 2%. An improvement, but it didn't alter the fact that they had mislead us. Call me stubborn if you like, but I refused to go ahead and told them precisely what to do with their offer. We told the head office the whole story to see if they would do something to try to make amends and keep our business, but all they did was insincerely apologise. So we decided to quit with them and go with another bank (Mandiri). They also charge 2%, but at least they are up-front about it, and there is no monthly rental fee.

This involved closing the BCA account - the one we only opened in the first place because they enticed us in with their false claims. Naturally they took this opportunity to add insult to injury by conjuring up some invented charges. So, instead of compensating us (ho ho) for all the problems they caused, they came up with a total of 800.000 Rupiah in charges that no-one in the bank could explain.

The end result, was that they charged us 800,000 for the dubious pleasure of weeks of dealing with a bunch of

Moderator edit for unnecessary insults.

It's such a shame when local companies take this short-term, money-grabbing, attitude. It's not good for them in the long term and it puts people off doing business in Indonesia. Be warned!

All credit card vendors charge a fee ranging from 1.5% to 3.5% depending on the type of credit card and the bank to who your connected . When taking an american express (and discover) they have the highest fee , thats why alot of people only that visa / mastercard . Its a normal .

I doubt, if your an adventure is an example of a "money grabbing attitude".

It maybe an example of sometimes badly or hardly trained people.

I agree with Bert, this is more likely an example of poorly trained staff and that BCA didn't handle your business very well.

This is obviously your first experience as a credit card merchant - Visa, Mastercard etc are separate businesses to the banks they deal with. They ALWAYS charge a percentage of the transaction in fees. That is worldwide, what-ever country you are doing business in.

As a guide, 2% to 3% is pretty normal for a first time merchant, but based on your turn-over you should be able to negotiate that down to around 1.2 - 1.8 after a year (but not if you only do a bit of business through ccard)

The 150,000Rp per month was BCA's charge to you. They don't get the 2%.

Personally I've always found BCA to be pretty good, slow - but you get there in the end.

Freo

Freo,Android knew that there is usually a charge, thats why he kept asking several times... Bca was wrong- but come on everybody knows there are charges by card companies( he ownes villas)...... he got what he asked for- nothing for nothing....... Dont know why he is so surprised to find a little incompetence in Bali- its part of the culture- get use to it or go home...... I hope I didnt look as bad when I use to Complain? but I'm sure I did

OK so we've established that these charges are entirely normal, but that's not my point at all. I was already semi-aware of that when I approached BCA - who told me there were no charges above the monthly rental fee. I asked them to confirm this, which they did. I asked again, and they confirmed it again. Who knows? Maybe this was a new business strategy on their part. Remember, this was not coming from some poorly trained local staff, this came from the head office! Call me naive if you like, but I went with the information they volunteered until it proved to be false - at which point I chose to take my business elsewhere. This was not because they charged, it was because they were not up-front about that fact. Anyway, the bank I have moved to also charge 2% per transaction, and that's absolutely fine.

That would have been the end of the matter, but they then rubbed salt into the wound by charging 800.000 Rupiah for the experience. As I mentioned before, the bank staff were unable to explain these charges. Maybe they were legitimate, but it doesn't exactly look good in my opinion. If they couldn't find it in themselves to waive these charges, the very least they could do would be to clarify what they were for. Otherwise, I am left to draw my own conclusions.

Thanks for the "get used to it or go home" advice Froggy. I'm not at all surprised by incompetence, and I'm not surprised by shady business practices either, but that doesn't stop me from posting a warning about my experience. I have found a number of people and organisations that are competent and professional. It takes time to identify them, but they do exist and I don't allow the poorer examples to taint my opinion about the culture in Bali.

Oh! believe me I know of the frustrations you are mentioning,, but to the locals and their perspective , they live on bali time and in bali land(rules or lack of)- do we want bali to be all professional etc all the time? like Singapore or ??... and its you that has to adapt to this kind of practise or it will drive you nuts.... just shrug it off and prepare yourself for the next exciting encounter.... its all good.... everythings going to be allright...YA'Man

I'm sure the western educated bank manager thinks damn its hard to get good .25 cent an hour help these days, the labor pool there is not exactly up to the standards you are accustom to, If they were as good as you would want them to be, they would prob. be working eleswhere for better wages,,, just a thought......

i've found bca ok in my dealings with them.. certainly one of the more reliable of the local banks with a good branch network.. it's an unfortunate experience to go through and the 800,000 is really a slap in the face.. in any case, you've found another service provider who meets your needs.. i work for a bank - one of the largest in the world and believe me screwing people is a fantastic source of income

all the best..

ct

BaliLife wrote:.. i work for a bank - one of the largest in the world and believe me screwing people is a fantastic source of income

I guess this remark was made tongue-in-cheek but you may care to browse this website for horror stories relating to UK banks: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk. Pay particular reference to the column "Charges Returned". It makes interesting reading as does a thread by someone called Sparkie vs. The Royal Bank of Scotland.

As this is a Bali forum, let me say I've been away for a month or so staying with my parents-in-law in their village in Tampak Siring. It was a great experience as I have never stayed there for any length of time before. Although I and my bule-looking daughter were something of a curiosity, I was treated with nothing but kindness by everyone I met while staying there. My daughter (18months) experienced for the first time the full-on attentions of the village kids and it overwhelmed her initially. But even after only a month of living in the village, I think she is now more outgoing with other children - maybe it's my imagination. For me, it was a chance to experience the "real" life in Bali, away from the tourist strip.

In Ubud (the nearest I got to being a tourist) I noticed one bloke who had got tired of asking the tourists "Transport?" had hung a laminated sign around his neck instead. How laid back can you get? Also in Ubud, a lady tourist approached a street trader selling masks etc., quickly took his photograph then ran away back to her air-conditioned bus without buying anything or even saying thank-you. The trader only smiled and shrugged his shoulders. I wonder what she will say when she shows the photo to her friends back home?

Other firsts for this trip were:-

* First person in history to introduce Irish Banjo to the banjar (that's my claim anyway).
* First time on a bicycle in Bali including a heart-attack-inducing trip from Ubud to Kintamani (I have witnesses I made it the whole way).
* First time to ride a motor bike on my own.
* First ever tattoo (in memory of my late twin)
* First time to get beaten at chess by a ten year old kid.

Being back in the suburbs of Brisbane again seems like returning to the "land of the living dead". Many Balinese may be poor by our standards but in my experience, they know how to live life to the full.

Sam

Sam I agree with you fully! As an australian I still love my country and its outback, but not the rat race it has become, give me Bali any day.

Trust me, I've had many similar experiences like this and it was not a surprise at all. Let's keep this in proportion. All I wanted to do was share it with this forum so that others may be warned. If I was in the position of becoming a credit card merchant in Bali and searched for the terms "credit card", "bank", etc. I would be grateful to read this story.

Personally, I love Bali (otherwise I wouldn't have a home there) and fully respect the culture and way of life. I feel that we in the West have a lot to learn from the Balinese, especially about family life, living for the moment, achieving balance, and not "sweating the small stuff". On the other hand, there are times when you just want to get something done. That is when you need someone who takes responsibility for seeing a job through. I'm lucky enough to have developed good working relationships with some people like that - and I treasure them dearly.

It's a bit like a process of natural selection: I listen to a person's (or organisation's) promises and note them without really believing or relying on them. Then I wait to see if they deliver. If they do, I continue to deal with them. If they don't (unless there's a very good reason, not excuse), I just drop them and move onto the next one. Maybe 70% let me down, but that doesn't get me excited or frustrated. As Froggy and others pointed out, it's part of the culture (Bali time, etc.) and there's no point getting worked up about it. They are usually very nice, charming people and they have fascinating stories about how they weren't quite able to achieve whatever they had said they would. All very entertaining, but not very useful when you're in business.

So BCA were incompetent (at best) and added insult to injury by getting me to pay through the nose. What should one do in this situation? Take them to court? Tell the police? Demonstrate outside their head office? Burn effigies of the BCA chairman? Of course not. I don't have the time or motivation to bother with any of that - and I know it wouldn't achieve anything anyway (apart from making me look foolish). Perhaps I should just shrug and move on, understanding that it's an inevitable part of the culture in Bali. Well, no; in my experience it is not inevitable and it's insulting to the genuine and hard-working Balinese people I know to draw such a conclusion. It's also, in my humble opinion, the very purpose of forums such as this to allow people to share their good and bad experiences to the benefit of the whole group and, possibly, to discourage organisations from getting away with such behaviour. Therefore, I think it's fair enough to post a warning and then move on. That seems to be a reasonable and balanced response. It doesn't mean I hate all Balinese people or think that BCA is an evil terrorist organisation. It also doesn't mean that I think all other banks (including Western ones) are perfect or that I guarantee everyone is going to be screwed by BCA at every opportunity. It simply means that I had a bad experience with them and have posted the results for others to see. Nothing more. Enough said?

Android - your a MOD Edit: not needed is it ?