Bali Expat Forum - Bali Travel Forum

Hi, Laj

I always understood that this Fiscal was in fact supposed to be a pre-payment on your income tax. Theory being that if you were rich enough to travel, you were rich enough to pay tax.

I always thought if you're rich enough you have enough money to pay your accountants to minimize your tax obligation to the very minimum (like zero, or even less).

The fiskal tax people have been talking about here is the hefty "departure tax" for Indonesians and expats on work/retirement visas who want or need to get out of the country. Expats actually have to pay more because they need to apply (and pay) for an exit permit, as well as the fiskal at their point of departure.

Two recent articles in The Jakarta Post are good for a laugh.

Taxpayers not filing returns
http://www.thejakartapost.com/detailedi ... 071002.E01

And this rather short one which claims that less than 2% of the Bali population actually have a tax number to begin with:

Very few pay tax in Bali
http://www.thejakartapost.com/yesterday ... 071001.D12

There are moves afoot to bring Indonesian tax collection into the 21st Century by introducing electronic ID's and employing computer systems. We can all wait breathlessly for this to occur. I just hope that the first people they go after are the millionaires and billionaires who haven't been doing the right thing for decades.

Hi Sanurian,

You wrote; "I always thought if you're rich enough you have enough money to pay your accountants to minimize your tax obligation to the very minimum (like zero, or even less)."

Of course you are completely right there. That is exactly why the payment of this 'Fiscal Tax' when leaving the country (at least when they are not leaving in their private planes etc.) is probably the only tax these people who are rich enough to hire these accountants will ever pay!!

The last time I had to pay this as a tax-resident in Indonesia, I had to pay IDR 100K departure tax and IDR 1 juta Fiskal at Jakarta airport. Again, I thought this 1 juta was in theory a 'prepayment' on your income tax payable at the end of the year. Was just wondering if anyone on this forum had ever been brave, or foolish, enough to take the tax inspection up on this, and tried to deduct these fiskals from their income tax. Assuming of course you are all nice and law (including tax) abiding citizens, you all pay taxes and you all have kept the receipts of these fiskals.

When I was living in Jakarta, in the whole of Permata Hijau, let's say not exactly one of the slums of Jakarta, there was 1 (one, satu) registered tax payer in the whole area. After reading the editorial in the Jakarta Post you mentioned, I now guess that number has dropped to zero.

The other article states that less than 2% of the Balinese population has a tax number. What was again the percentage of foreigners/expats on the total population in Bali? You're not cheating are you?

Laj wrote:Was just wondering if anyone on this forum had ever been brave, or foolish, enough to take the tax inspection up on this, and tried to deduct these fiskals from their income tax.

I think not too many people here have any experience with this, as I assume that the majority of the participants of this forum do not file income tax declaration at all (despite the obligation).
In fact, simply deducting the fiscal in your tax return should not draw a tax inspection automatically (as for example reclaiming any tax paid in advance does!)

Upon looking at my online bank account I find that every month when interest is added I also pay income tax staright away on that interest.

If I am typical it means that all who have a deposit account in Indonesia also pay tax. Just a thought to add to this topic.

Jimbo wrote:Upon looking at my online bank account I find that every month when interest is added I also pay income tax staright away on that interest.

If I am typical it means that all who have a deposit account in Indonesia also pay tax. Just a thought to add to this topic.

Yes, because that is a withholding tax deducted by the bank (fiscal is another withholding tax). But do you pay tax on your personal income from whatever business you are involved in? Do you file your income tax return every year?

No because I do not have a business there or have any income from there.

Jimbo wrote:No because I do not have a business there or have any income from there.

OK, but then you do not really need a KITAS, i.e. fiscal would not be applicable to you.

Many countries enforce the deducting of withholding tax for non-residents.

If you submit tax returns in a country that has a tax treaty with Indonesia you should be able to get a deduction for the withholding tax you have paid out. Of course you would then have to declare the interest income which most people don't want to do.

The reason fiscal tax and withholding tax and other similar collection mechanisms exist is for the simple reason that tax avoidance is prevalent.