Thread: Converting to Islam

Colourful, I wonder if you have lived in Indonesia? If you have, surely you have noticed how religion is so much a part of every day life, as natural as eating and bathing. In the west, more often than not, religion is almost 'separate' from our lives. In Indonesia it is not separate, it is as important as work, play, or any activity we do. Religion forms most of the community life in Indonesia.

So, my experience is that what works is that when you live in a village, you are the same religion as most of the others in your village. I fully understand why Indonesia passed the marriage law. I think it would be very difficult if say a wife was Hindu and husband Muslim, or visa versa. The practicalities of ceremonies and duties at the temple/mosque would be disharmonious, to say the least.

There must be a reason why a country with a population of over 200 million people are quite accepting of the marriage law. Seen from outside, maybe it looks strange, but internally it works very well.

Roy, thanks for your comments. I was going to write something along the lines of suggesting that a conversion to any religion could be taken more seriously. There is something special about sharing that part of your life with your life partner.

Thanks FreoGirl,

Could not have explained it better myself and I did try late last night but thought I would sleep on it.

To make a long story short Islam is part of my fiance life ingrained and it is apart of who he is without it he would be a different person. He believes in his religion 100%, I have seen this with my own eyes and I do not believe in any particular religion. Don't get me wrong I do have my beliefs but I would not put it under any one religion.

Indonesians are very tolerent people, so much more than I have experienced here in Australia and after reading as many books as I could get my hands on I now have an understanding of a religion that once scared me.

His whole family accept me for who I am and in my discussions with them about our marriage I feel they are fantastic (could not find another word suitable). Anyway do not want to go into it too much just to say I am happy and proud even to convert to Islam.

There is something special about sharing that part of your life with your life partner.

That is so very, very true!

You also wrote,

“So, my experience is that what works is that when you live in a village, you are the same religion as most of the others in your village.”

That is also, very, very true. When other than Balinese Indonesians come to Bali for a period of work, they often congregate in the same areas. The same goes for Balinese who live in other parts of Indonesia...and this is especially seen in Lombok and areas of eastern Java.

Freogirl wrote:

I fully understand why Indonesia passed the marriage law. I think it would be very difficult if say a wife was Hindu and husband Muslim, or visa versa.

Surely this should be one's personal choice and not be dictated to them by a group of schmucks that couldn't run a primary school canteen - yes, I'm talking about the Indonesian parliament!

Anybody who subscribes to this belief is not entitled to suggest that Singapore is a 'controlling' state or a 'fascist' state (not saying you've indicated that Freogirl, but others have). This is a blatant breach of human rights but more importantly, it's an insult to the intelligence of the average indonesian. I suspect, SBY would have such a policy in his sights for revocation.

I don't respect religious beliefs. In fact as an atheist I think that an adult practicising religion is as rediculous as an adult believing that Snow White actually sat down with 7 dwarfs before being poisened by the wicked witch. But, I do respect peoples right to believe in whatever it is they wish to believe in and practice whatever religion they wish to - this law clearly shows that until now the Indonesian government has not believed in those rights.

Ct

BaliLife, I “hear” you loud and clear, and to some degree, I even understand your outrage, BUT, the reality is, one never hears complaints about this from Indonesians who plan to marry other Indonesians. I expect that there are exceptions, but, personally, I’ve never heard of any.

What FreoGirl is describing, and I agree with her 100%, this is more a cultural thing, than a religious thing. It’s actually very practical in many ways.

If you really think that this is such a gross violation of human rights, don’t you think it should be up to Indonesians to make their voices heard, and change the law?

Personally, I'll take the laws passed by the MPR in Jakarta most any day over the Draconian "people control" laws of Singapore.

Roy, you're very right in that I've never heard an Indonesian complain about this.

I believe it says something rather unfortunate about Indonesians, the fact that this is not problematic for them. It may also be attributed to the fact that the large large large majority of Indonesians wouldn't marry outside of their own faith anyway. Or perhaps the political intellect of Indonesia is too consumed with who should be the next president of the National Dangdut Committee.

Either way, I think it goes back to what I suggested in another thread: Democracy is dangerous in the hands of the uneducated.

Ct

Nothing much to add except to acknowledge that we have very different views on this matter. That makes for more interesting discussion any day, and on that I think we would both agree. Cheers!

Roy - I agree, it does make for an interesting conversation, and please don't misunderstand me - I'm not opposed to the notion of conversion in order for a married couple to share a common religion, I'm just opposed to such being required by law. I can't say I've experienced sharing a faith with my wife - but I believe freogirl's and your own viewpoint that such is a special experience.

Kadek wrote:

I think, people who are married and still maintain their respective religions can have a harmonious relationship.

I also agree.

Ct

And let’s not forget the point Bert made very early on in this discussion...that being the option of a civil only marriage, which appears to be entirely legal within Indonesia.