Bali Expat Forum - Bali Travel Forum

[mimpimanis]

Made can not drive a car - and before I am allowing him behind the wheel of our new one he has to take a course. Though I am not sure how good even the d riving schools are (in Lombok, not Bali) But I am hoping that he will learn some basic safety issues like breaking distances, not overtaking on solid white lines etc.

One gripe I have too at the moment is that most people seem to use full beams at night even on busy roads. Jalan Ulawatu at 7pm is full and about one in 10 cars coming in the opposite direction at me, has their headlights dipped, making it a real strain to try and see the road infront.

And a habit I have to get out of is the english one of flashing your lights at someone to tell them to go ahead.... here is means the opposite!

[milan]

I guess you have to use common sense, mimpimanis. Actually, you put a smile on my face as it reminds me of my husband's experience driving in England how he couldn't cope with the roundabout as here in Italy, even though they do have it, it is a smaller version where they can just take their time. In England, the traffic goes so fast that with his Italian temper, all the expletives were out of his mouth as he missed the direction he wanted to take. It's so comical... I wish I had taken a film of it.

[milan]

And a habit I have to get out of is the english one of flashing your lights at someone to tell them to go ahead.... here is means the opposite!

I referred to this comment above that's what makes me smile. It's funny.

[FreoGirl]

My sister-in-law died in a motorbike accident a few years ago. She was on the back of an ojek, sitting side-saddle, coming back from the market one morning with basket of food balanced on her head - as is the way in many parts of Indonesia. Another motorbike cut them off causing the ojek to swerve, she lost her balance and fell off and cracked her head on the pavement and died on the side of the road. No emergency ambulance service for her - it was Mataram.

Police may enforce the wearing of a plastic bucket on your head during the day, but not women coming back from the market. And for some reason, not for anybody at night. No-one wears a helmet at night in Lombok - I suspect many parts of Bali are the same. Surely it is more dangerous at night?

And then what about the family of 5 on the motorbike - off to temple. No-one wears a helmet otherwise it would mess up the hair-do. And if they are wearing a helmet, the kids NEVER are. How come kids don't have to wear helmets?

I find some of the most reckless motorbike riders are the teenage boys - maybe 14 or 15 years old - who have motorbikes to go to school. The risks they take, and the speed they go, is typical of any teenage boy - and there is no way they had a proper lesson in their lives. Do they have licenses? Don't know..

There seem to be many 'cultural' reasons behind many of the unsafe motorbike practices, not only in Bali but other parts of Indonesia as well. Education and enforcement is needed to improve the situation.

[Sanurian]

Hi, FreoGirl
Sorry and sad to hear about your sister-in-law.

This sort of thing happens often in Bali. I only learned today of an expat acquaintance of mine in Sanur who got knocked off his motorbike the other night and is now in Sanglah Hospital with various neck injuries. Hope he survives.

...Police may enforce the wearing of a plastic bucket on your head during the day, but not women coming back from the market. And for some reason, not for anybody at night...

I doubt that it has anything to do with "logic", or even "common sense".

...And then what about the family of 5 on the motorbike - off to temple. No-one wears a helmet otherwise it would mess up the hair-do. And if they are wearing a helmet, the kids NEVER are. How come kids don't have to wear helmets?...

Traffic "laws" in Bali make an exception for people going to ceremonies, wearing traditional dress. I have no idea why children don't have to wear "helmets", or even have seat belts when they're in a car. Just plain ignorance, stupidity, or both.

[mimpimanis]

In my experience in Lombok, people dont wear a helmet for safety reasons but to avoid being fined by the police. If they aren't going to pass through one of the bigger towns, with police, no need for a helmet. I guess as there are no police on traffic duty at night this is why no helmets either.

[Kadek]

Traffic in Bali is indeed crazy and dangerous. Maybe it is a cultural thing, maybe people are only thinking of the convinient of the moment, instead of long term planning, maybe it is economical reason, or maybe it is just ignorant and stupidity, lack of knowledge of personal safety and safety of others on the roads and lack of enforcement of road rules (which I think nobody knows about). Maybe all of these factors play a role in the chaos? All of these are coupled with narrow, unlit, and poorly signed roads. So what to do? Education. But who will do this

As for teenager drivers. I think this is not typical Balinese. It is everywhere. I know two boys in OZ who stollen their parents' car, drove it in the middle of the night and then crashed rolled it on the highway. They were ok and as for the car - it was new but it was towed to the wrecker! and many also drink drive and got killed in car accidents.

As for drivers in the West, they are also not always following the rules or comply with rules because it is safer, but from my observation only do so because fear of fine and the police.
so many are still driving whilst speaking on their mobile phones, so many are still taigating, so many are still driving too slow on the highways, speedings etc...

[Sanurian]

Halo, Kadek

...Traffic in Bali is indeed crazy and dangerous. Maybe it is a cultural thing...
So what to do? Education. But who will do this...

Who, indeed? How about the Indonesian government, for starters? And the local Balinese government officials, for seconds?

I don't think it's a "cultural" thing. Your comparisons with western countries are unwarranted. Sure, there are idiot drivers/riders everywhere, but given the relatively small size of Bali and the sheer numbers of "lethal weapons" on its roads, I think you will find that on a per-capita basis, Bali is way over the top, in its "accident" figures. Whatever statistics one looks at.

Effective or realistic attempts to decrease the growing incidences of road accidents here are hard to find.

[Kadek]

Halo Philip,

I am not comparing it to western countries to give excuses to the nightmares of traffic and bad behaviours of drivers in Bali. Rather I am only trying to say that people take risks - knowingly or through ignorant no matter if there are rules or not. And in the absent of any government direction, education, enforcement of law and regulations, these human tendencies and bad behaviours tend to get exagerated as there are no control - and thus the situation in Bali.

Of course it is first and foremost the governments role to put something in place to change things. But the population must also demand that from the governments - government won't act if the people aren't happy with the way things are. But if the majority of people are only thinking of their own in the moment convinient, than any risk to him/herself as well as others are not part of the decision making that give rise to the bad behaviours?


Cheers
Kadek

[BaliLife]

One of the justifications for mandatory helmet use in countries such as Australia and Canada (besides common sense) is that these countries provide state funded healthcare. Why should taxpayers incur the expense of stupidity?

I believe that if a person in Australia or Canada is in an accident and they weren't wearing their seatbelt or a helmet, and it is the opinion of the doctors that the injuries could have been avoided or reduced if the subject was wearing a seatbelt or helmet, then the injured subject should be issued a bill for medical expenses incurred by the state.

Ct

[Roy]

Effective or realistic attempts to decrease the growing incidences of road accidents here are hard to find.

You’ve been living on Bali a long time Phil. Surely you have at least noted a huge increase in the number of traffic lights, and much improved road infrastructure during that time.

In any event, this entire string serves as a good self reminder just why I don’t drive in Bali. I never have, and I never will.

[tintin]

Roy,

Did it ever occur to you that people die in car or motorcycle accidents even if they are not the driver of the vehicle?

Actually, call me crazy (that would be the first time anyway), but I love driving my motorcycle in Bali. My wife taught me on her own motorcycle in the US, so I could drive in Bali (No, she does not have a life insurance on my person). I seldom drive her motorcycle in Boston, as I find it unsafe. Since 1967 or 1968, I have been driving in Bali, had several close calls, couple of tabrakan, and invariably each year, I leave (literally) a small blood sacrifice on the road. Love it until last October... I then found that old age, diminished eyesight (I need a cataract operation), and the rather large increase in traffic made it not such a nice experience in the large aglomerations. But in the remote places, riding a cycle is unadultarated FREEDOM.

[Roy]

Did it ever occur to you that people die in car or motorcycle accidents even if they are not the driver of the vehicle?

Yes, oh great and enlightened one...it has occurred to me! However, given my ever deteriorating eye sight, (I’m due for another cataract surgery), especially at night, a slowing down of reflex time, and my complete unwillingness to be held responsible for ANY accident I would be blamed for if driving, discretion has taken over my once joy of driving for simple and plain common sense.

Remember Daniel, I live here, and you don't. I have much to lose by foolishness, and I define freedom in an entirely different language.

[BaliLife]

I love reading you two going at it in a fully fledged pissing match.. I laugh my arse off.. Keep it up guys..

(Seriously - this is not sarcastic)..

Ct

[Roy]

BTW Daniel, I notice that you keep backing up the dates you were first in Bali, as with your last post...

“Since 1967 or 1968, I have been driving in Bali...”

I find these stories to be of endless amusement, and since you never took photographs, as you have often stated, I thought you could use this one to convince others:

You could title it, “me and assistant shaving in Bali in 1936.”

[Sanurian]

...Surely you have at least noted a huge increase in the number of traffic lights, and much improved road infrastructure during that time.

Yes I have, Roy.

I've also noticed lots of traffic lights with orange bulbs on the top, many broken and unrepaired ones, others that have been built and never once turned on in years, etc. I also still see, on a daily basis, many road users not stopping for a red light, running red lights, some stopping then changing their minds.

One thing that's always intrigued me is why there are manned police booths at most traffic lights? What's the point of having the lights in the first place if there's a need to have a police contingent "at the ready", presumably to catch offenders? That makes traffic lights a very expensive exercise.

It seems to me that some local road users regard traffic lights as an annoying inconvenience, or maybe even just there for decorative purposes, like lights on a Christmas tree.

For many, the "improved road infrastructure" means they can drive/ride faster. I wonder if anybody's looked for a correlation between "improved roads" and "accidents"?