history lesson

[RhysG]

Dose any one know the history of bali or indonesia ??????
a question i have been asking my self for the past few week. yes i do ask my self a lot of question(you can call it multipel personality disorder i call it social networking in my head). The resone i ask this question because i found it alarming the amount of mix indo and indonesian kid and adult that have been asking thing such as where did the Indonesian language come from? why is the indonesian flag red and white ? how how come bali and a bit's of lombok the on island in indonesia that is hindu? that when i go what do you learn at school? I think it more importan to learn history instead of studying these new ib programs where in the real world you wouldn't even use 90 % of the shit you learn dose any here ever get asked what is pie (as in the math equation)?. So i brought to my self to educate a few people and tell them what i know and what i learnt back in the 5th grade ( when eve that was.

Where the indonesian language came from?
The Indonesian language cames form a mix of dutch,Portuguese, Riau dialect of Malay an Austronesian language which has been used as a lingua franca in the Indonesian archipelago for centuries.
Dutch obviously when the dutch tried take indonesia
Portuguese druning the spice terads (and if you dont kno when that was for god sake put the beer down and move a way from the t.v and learn this shit) the spice trades was Inda Indonesia and back to Europe
Riau has been around from the start of when they where pople in indonesia.

Whys is the indonesian flag red and white?
now as we should all know that the dutch were in indonesia from 1846 till 1945, in December 1949, when in the face of international pressure, the Dutch formally recognised Indonesian independence. Now the dutch flag if bule red and white when indonesia went against the dutch (to become independent ) the stormed in to there main head quarters o f the dutch embassy/office and climb the flag pole and rip off the bule of the dutch flag as the Dutch slowly shot one by one off the flag pole (1945) the resone the Indonesian revaluation army ( i think that what they where called) could storm the office because the head of the indonesian revaluation I gusti nura rai (balinese) turned him self into to the Dutch and the were all celebration second in command cunayt din ( don't remember where she from and if that how u spell her name) lead the rest of the revolutionist into the dutch office ass the were celebrating the captur of i husti nura rai.

how come bali the island with majority of hindus?
the frist hindu arrived in bali as early as 100 BC, but the unique culture to bali hails largely from neighboring java,with some influence for from bali's distance animist past.The Javanese majapahit empire's ruled over bali became complet in the 14th century when gajah mada,prie minister of the Javanese king, defeated the balinese king at bedulu. The very few balinese who did not adopt this javanes hindu clutter are know to day as bali aga "original Balinese" and are still alive today villages of tenganan near candidasa and trunyan on the remote eastern shore of lake batur at kintamani.The rise of islam in indonesia archipelago, the majaphit empire in java fell and bali become independent near the turn of the 16th century. The javanese aristocracy found refuge in bali,brining an even stronger influx of hindu art,literure and religion.

iF any one would like too add or think i have given fales information please comment.
thank hope you enjoyed reading this.

[gilbert de jong]

nice post RhysG...

about the flag of indonesia...think a very romanticized/dramatized story (not saying it ain't true)...
basically there was the KNIL (Koninklijk Nederlands-Indie Leger) and they had a red/white/blue flag on their uniform and ofcourse at their camps/barracks...there were also Indonesians
inside the KNIL...now when the shit hit the fan sort a speak, the KNIL was parted in two, Indonesians who fought on the
Indo side and some Indonesian stayed at the dutch side..back to the uniform, wich were the same (duh) so the freedom-fighters ripped of the blue from the flag so they could recognize
who's friend or foe...this is how it has been told to me by my grandfather who was back then an Indonesian captain (ingenieur with the genie corps) with the KNIL.

As for the language, Bahasa Indonesia has not been used for centuries as you say. even till to this day it's a second language to many many Indonesian..it's only the official Indonesian
language, can't have a country without a national language..right ;) can expalin in detail, but long story and will leave that for someone else to tell/write..


But again RhysG..very good thread..

[ronb]

On this issue of language, the writings of Pramoedya Ananta Toer give some insights. My take on it is that from around 1900, a movement was growing to fight for freedom from Dutch rule. This movement was centred in Java and involved many educated people who could speak Dutch. However, to rally support across all of the Dutch East Indies, and to reach people of all classes they needed a language. Javanese would not build support outside Java, Dutch would not reach the masses - only the educated elite. So they looked to "market Malay" - used widely by traders who moved from island to island. Here is an excerpt from the Translator's Notes at the beginning of the English translation of "This Earth of Mankind" - the first from a set of 4 novels.

There are many more revelations for the reader about life in Java during this period. The reader may note, for example, the constant references to the languages used by the characters: Javanese, Dutch, Malay, Madurese, High Javanese. The use of language in this period was an important indicator of a person’s social caste. Dutch, of course, was the language of the governing caste; Javanese, the Native language of the Javanese; and Madurese, the Native language of Madura (an. island off Java). Malay was the language of interracial, or intercaste, communication (as many elite Javanese could speak Dutch), as well as the language of many Eurasians. Indeed, in situations in which the caste order needed to be emphasized, Natives were forbidden to use Dutch. Not only did colonialism install Dutch as the supreme caste language of Java, it helped reinforce and even exaggerate caste distinctions in the Native languages themselves, especially Javanese. The Javanese language already operated on at least three different levels, each based on the person to whom one was speaking or the person who was doing the speaking. This feudal stratification was given extra force as Javanese feudal notables, devoid of real political power in the face of the Dutch cannon and Dutch capital, channeled their oppressive energies into culture, something which Dutch cannon and capital were, in turn, frequently ready to buttress. The egalitarian and colloquial Javanese that was used in the palaces and royal houses of Java actually died out in this period. Only the masses of peasants and other toilers retained such an egalitarian Javanese.